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PostSubject: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 5:25 am

I searched, but I wasn't entirely sure what the general consensus is with regards to whether giant predators are literate. I'd have assumed that those who weren't taught to read and write were not, living in the jungle and all... but it might be that all Felaryan giant predators usually ARE brought up with this ability by their parents, and illiterate ones are less common.

I'm not sure, does anyone know?
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 5:42 am

I'd assume that the big majority of the tauric races are primitive and illiterate. When you're stuck in the wild fighting for survival, and in essence you're a wild animal that talks and thinks, who has time for reading or doing something that doesn't keep you alive?
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 6:47 am

We know that some giant predators can read - Vivian, for instance. But my assumption has always been that most of them cannot. We've never heard of reading material circulating among giant preds, and most, of course, have no education system.

There may be a difference between species which congregate in communities (such as fairies), and those who have a more individual lifestyle.

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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 6:55 am

Isn't it a bit strange that my four preds are literate? I mean, my dryad learnt reading from her preys, then she taught her fairy friend... My dridder has her own journal and I'm pretty sure succubi are literate.

But I guess it depends on the cultural aspects of each species and community. So isolated memebers of a species might end up being quite iliterate - that doesn't mean they aren't intelligent, remember -, but communities will be more likely to have rich literature.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 7:06 am

I have a literate dridder that picked a book from a human, and she's seen reading most of the time as a result. I also have a male (GASP!) naga who's also literate.

Also, don't forget, Crisis is also literate, since there's a good chance Lea taught her.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:43 am

GlobFish wrote:
I searched, but I wasn't entirely sure what the general consensus is with regards to whether giant predators are literate. I'd have assumed that those who weren't taught to read and write were not, living in the jungle and all... but it might be that all Felaryan giant predators usually ARE brought up with this ability by their parents, and illiterate ones are less common.

I'm not sure, does anyone know?

Yeah, most giant predators are illiterate, since a great many do not have a single unified culture. Exceptions to this would be Dridders in the Dridder Forest who have close ties to the former Empire, Fairies who were born and raised in the Fairy Kingdom, and other such cases. The vast majority of preds are not born into groups like that though, and are just never taught to read. Literacy is a product of civilization and culture, and if you have neither, you really don't have any reason to read most of the time. It is perfectly possible for them to be taught though, and those preds who have human friends probably pick up a couple things here and there.

The same can be said for a lot of the humans and human-sized people as well. You're really only going to see written language in the more developed places like Negav, Chiotia, Safe Harbor, the Jungle Bowl and so on.

Also, keep in mind that the translation effect doesn't work on written word. While there is no language barrier for spoken word, the one for written word is still there. It is quite likely that in Negav there is some kind of "common" form of written language used, since there are people from dozens of worlds and each of them is going to have their own unique written language.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:27 am

rcs619 wrote:

Also, keep in mind that the translation effect doesn't work on written word. While there is no language barrier for spoken word, the one for written word is still there.
THANK YOU.

I see that being overlooked every so often, and it's annoying. We have differing theories and all on why people of many languages can all understand each other, but I do believe it's been established this only works for face-to-face spoken word (which is why my money's on subtle psychic linkage).
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 11:46 am

Back in the days of the old elven empire (if we go by JT/CB24's ideas) then the elves that 'subsumed' the nagas and other giants into their culture, they might have been taught to read, and handed it down. Also, if any of them are friends with fairies, the fairies might be able to teach them to read.

I like the idea of the translation effect not working on written word - you can see a bit of the species' original language untranslated, which adds to an awesome piece of culture. Trained mages, or mages of any kind will probably have to be able to read a great varying different liturgies/documents/etc. because every different culture has their own unique spells and techniques that need to be translated.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 12:06 pm

Curious thing... remember I was saying my dryad - Seelvee - knew from her preys how to read? I used that for making her a bit of a polyglot... Of course, I wasn't aware back then that the translation effect didn't work on written texts, but oh well...

Still, later when people spoke of how the translation effect wasn't 100% effective, I asumed that texts wouldn't be altered. It'd give some secrecy, for example, for some groups to have their own codes and keep their secrets safe. I like that idea, myself.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 12:40 pm

Ruby can read; Aisu taught her, along with how to speak, write, do basic math, etc...

I support the notion that most preds are illiterate. It makes sense; unless you either have a literate guardian like Ruby or you're at a sage-level of knowledge like Vivian, you really won't have access to the proper learning tools.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:28 pm

Here's my spin:

Reya has the equivalent of a college education at a level of at least post-graduate. She is rather good at understanding and grasping mechanical and physics parameters but has issues understanding certain features and facets of culture. Out of all the preds in Felarya, she's probably one of the leaders in technological knowledge. Anna probably has more grass-roots exposure due to her previous life, but Reya can go toe-to-toe with Triela on things such as drive harmonics and power generation making her a very 'token-esque' predator.

Kaede probably has some knowledge and literacy from her time at the Academy of Sentinels, and I imagine any predators that attend the Academy are also at least somewhat versed in written language. The inquisitive and curious nature of fairies probably also helps propagate that.

I'd say Aidee is most probably illiterate. She obviously has the mental capacity for it but from her perspective why would she ever need to learn?

Navia and Cyaer are illiterate. They are the two slimoid twins I have yet to publicly introduce. While again they would have the mental capacity for it, what reason would a slimoid have to learn how to read? I can't think of any, and besides in my conversations with AJ and a few others I concurred with the notion that slimoids shouldn't think along a 'normal' line of thought. I think some of my proposals and implementations of slimoids will freak people out, but I think personally that it fits with their style.

The scorpisai character I plan to introduce eventually will also be illiterate.



There are definitely some examples where I could see predators being literate, such as in Vivian's case and any pred that goes to an established learning field such as the Academy. I would say that the majority of the population wouldn't be literate though. Can you really see Crisis putting forth the effort? Not unless Melany attaches humans to pages, and even then I doubt she'd be paying much attention.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:48 pm

Actually, due to a rumor on the wiki page, it's said that Crisis is probably literate, because Lea taught her. My personal guess is that she wanted to learn how to read lyrics.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:55 pm

Sean Okotami wrote:
Actually, due to a rumor on the wiki page, it's said that Crisis is probably literate, because Lea taught her. My personal guess is that she wanted to learn how to read lyrics.

Possibly. Also, keep in mind that literacy isn't a black and white thing. Just because a pred can read doesn't mean they'd be able to jump in start reading Lovecraft, for example. You'd probably have a decent number of preds that have picked up a couple things here and there, but are nowhere near high-school or even college level in terms of reading skills.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:57 pm

Quote :
Actually, due to a rumor on the wiki page, it's said that Crisis is probably literate, because Lea taught her. My personal guess is that she wanted to learn how to read lyrics.

well later in that tome she said like...she wished she could read books so...:/
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 3:04 pm

From what I get, the Doujins actually pick up recently after Anna becomes a Naga, so it's possible that it's taking place before Lea taught her how to read and write.

As a side note, I picture as a sweet, but nonetheless strict teacher. She knows how to encourage progress, but keeps that punishment hammer arm strong and isn't afraid to use it. That would fit well with her established person. Sweet on the outside, but ironed to the max on the inside. ... Or is it the other way around? I haven't checked her profile since 2008 or 09 I think.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 3:09 pm

If you have the kind of naga family that raises their young for a brief period of time before setting them on their own - then one can imagine (if said family operated that way for generations) then they might teach them how to read due to, like I said, remembering a bit of that knowledge back from the days of the elven empire. I don't think it'd be like 90% are illiterate and the other 10% can kinda-sorta read - but more like a 60-40 or 70-30 kind of figure. I support *most* being illiterate as most snakes have to learn to survive on their own, but nagas are sentient. Even if they have snake like habits, there aren't a lot of nagas around, they'd want to supervise their young for at least a brief period of time.

Naga culture is still vague. Yes, naga culture - I'm not giving up that they have one.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 3:45 pm

Honestly though, reading tends to be a bit of a luxary. Some predators are going to raise their kids for a while...but in all likelyhood they're going to be far more focused on survival training, magic training and such.

Some preds do have a culture, namely Dridders in the Dridder Forest, Fairies from the Fairy Kingdom, and I'd even say Dryads, since they are mentally linked and share tons of information anyways.

A lot of the predators born in the wild just don't have much culture to speak of. They have their parents, and possibly their parents' family and friends, but that's about it. There are probably some stories and legends passed down verbally, but I doubt very many of them have a written language to pass down too. I always felt that that the fall of the Elven Empire, and then later on, the Naga/Dridder war really shattered a lot of predator communities and cultures, and that's why you have so many preds that are born in the wild, and have no concept of the world beyond what their parents taught them, or they learned themselves from experience.

Outside of the Fairy Kingdom, Dridder Forest and the Dryad Network, about the only way a pred could learn to read is by meeting someone from one of those places and learning from them, or learning from a human, neko or elf. Reading is a product of civilization, and a great many predators have no civilization to speak of, and live fairly isolated lives beyond their small circle of friends. There's also the fact that learning to read a human language won't do you much good since the books would be far too small too read. It wouldn't suprise me if a lot of predators see reading as a mostly useless hobby. Its probably more of a curiousity amongst them than anything else.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 5:51 pm

it's funny to assume since a predator can read any written language but even if the predators can read it will be only to read and write in only the language it learned and not beyond.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Sun Mar 13, 2011 5:54 pm

Not to mention they would need a giant magnifying glass to read a lot of things. Or see a neera.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Mon Mar 14, 2011 2:33 am

Depends on the curiosity of the pred too. Maybe they want to learn other languages, but due to the translating effect, their only way to do so is through books. Of course, the whole "human books are too small", for example, can be a problem. Razz
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Mon Aug 01, 2011 6:58 pm

It's most likely that a predator will only be literate if they don't grow up in isolation. A naga that lives alone may be literate, but that's almost certainly because they weren't always alone. It also depends heavily on the importance of literacy in the circle in which the predator was raised. Nagas, to continue the example, are much less likely to find it important to keep records of things (I can imagine journal entries like: "Found a neko. It was yummy. Sleep now.") than are races such as Dridders that place a high importance both on themselves, and therefore the things they do on a daily basis.

Nekos (not giant predators, but predators still) are more likely only to have number systems so they can keep track of dates for farming or the results of certain hunts at different times of the year, whereas fairies are likely not to have any sort of writing system at all (it would probably seem boring and/or unnecessary to most of them, though I've already made a few exceptions myself ^^Wink.

Sphinxes...I think we can guess pretty well with sphinxes, actually, given their depiction on the wiki. :p

With marine predators it's harder to say. Those that live in groups, especially at great depths, will need ways other than verbal communication to get their points across, but most of them have developed physical traits such as bio-luminescence or mood reactive pigmentation, making written language somewhat obsolete. However, smaller marine predators, such as human sized mermaids, will likely also have number systems for record keeping, but very simple ones, as they lack the ability to write with pigmented substances underwater and will therefore likely have to do their record keeping with tablets rather than any sort of paper-like material.

Communication is probably slow enough between slug girls without adding writing into the mix, so it doesn't seem likely they'd be literate at all. :p

It seems the two most likely species to be literate are the Sphinxes and the Dridders; both of which because of their high regards for nobility, culture, and history.

Oh, and of course there's the harpies, but their language is such a mess I doubt they'd know how to write it down even if they could standardize it.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Mon Aug 01, 2011 7:44 pm

Mr. Delicious wrote:
whereas fairies are likely not to have any sort of writing system at all (it would probably seem boring and/or unnecessary to most of them, though I've already made a few exceptions myself ^^Wink.
The Great Almighty Wiki wrote:
A little known trait of fairies is they tend to adore reading and form a highly literate species. Sometimes, a simple way to get a prankster fairy to keep quiet, or one to forget about eating you is to hand them over a book.

Mr. Delicious wrote:
but most of them have developed physical traits such as bio-luminescence or mood reactive pigmentation, making written language somewhat obsolete.
How so, that is akin to saying because we can speak written language is obsolete.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Mon Aug 01, 2011 10:32 pm

I do believe it's stated somewhere in the wiki that Crisis can read, probably because Anna taught her how.
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PostSubject: Re: Reading skills of giant predators?   Mon Aug 01, 2011 11:44 pm

That was from Lea actually ^^
But yep Crisis can read and ... well write if you don't mind the typos XP

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