Negav Law and Politics

First off I'd like to say, that im sure many people have their own thoughts about how Negav's system of government works, and may be hesitant to change it, thus making it controversial also because of how they see the morals of the gov leaders operating...anyway, I'm not going to care too much about if people's stories are different than my version, aside from MrNobody, I don't think anybody's read all the Felarya stories. There's so many out there that if we wanted to make it so no one had to rewrite their stories based on canonizations...well first that's a naive idea, and second no one would be getting their ideas canonized in the first place. There's my little speech, a bit off topic, but whatever.

tl;dr - everyone has their own ideas about negav's government, and here's my take regardless of other people's previous ideas.



Negav Law & Politics

Negav's plebeians think more on a day to day, or survival first mentality. The harshness of the wilderness
has kept the spirits of the people on a "help yourself first" before anything else. Due to this, the
political system runs pretty freely without much drawback.

Districts and Taxes

Negav's districts are divided up into sectors called "Rotes". Each Rote has a representative that acts as a
simplified Mayor, and is a subordinate of the District Leaders. Rote leaders gather taxes, and head the
neighborhood watch. They have few official duties, and are the lowest of the low in the political system.
They report to the Division Leaders, who take the taxes, along with the report submitted to them by the
Roam Leaders. Division Leaders take the report, the taxes, and any other item of importance with them when
they are all gathered to vote and discuss ideas.

Laws and the Senate

Laws proposed are given to the Roters (Roam Leaders) who read it over and submit it to the District
Leaders, who take it with them to vote on and discuss for the possibility of passing it on to the Senate.
The Senate is the only office voted in. Each Senator also acts as a judge, and is a member of the circle of
Senators that judge whether or not it's valuable enough to be passed on to the Magiocracy for finalizing.
Each Senator appoints the District Leaders, who appoint the Roters. Because each senator thinks for
themself first, laws proposed by citizens are rarely passed. Laws proposed by Senators are the ones that
are usually passed by the Magiocracy. Senators are often suckups to their superiors, who even when
blatantly corrupt are hardly ever over thrown by a majority vote from the Senate just because they have the
ambition of some day getting there themselves, even if it's a pipe dream.

Magiocracy

This is where every "important" law ends up. What goes on in the Magiocracy is still a mystery, but in the end
laws are finalized and set into motion here. The Magiocrats all get in via a test, and whether or not they
were previously a senator may not matter even in the slightest. The Magiocracy rotates it's "chairman" once every
10 years, and citizens are given a chance to vote - but ninety-five percent of the time the chairman has already been
chosen, and there's only one name on the ballot. The Magiocrats all do deals with the top business owners, institutions,
or service branch. On the record one Magiocrat may be the ex-executive of the Investigators, but off the record may
still be running it.

Law Psychology

Laws are generally vague, allowing for the intentional use of loopholes by people who run vice circles.
Communities with a lot of shady shops and brothels will often be overlooked due to the recognition of the
economy these places fuel. Therefore prostitution and anti-sex laws aren't very well specified, and on the
occasion a place skirts the lines of the law, and even breaks it, they are usually only given a slap on the
wrist. Only rampant breaking of the law results in a court case, where a Senator is appointed as judge.

Healthcare

Healthcare is rather low, privatized, and usually provided for by various guilds that the taxes help
support. Medical supplies are left to the duty of the hospital.

Education

Education falls into branches under military jurisdiction, or the duty of the Mages Guild, who educate the
bulk of those who were rich enough to afford it. For this reason, the Mages Guild, and the Negavian
Security and Military forces are both given the most money from the government, and make the most profit.
The taxes gathered are often used as a "salary" for the Governmental officials instead, which is why much
of the system is hard to access.

Overview

The Political and Economic system is pretty grim, but a "serve thyself first" mentality keeps most people
being able to do much about it. Riots are rare, and only occur when enough people are genuinely angry at
the system. Of course the common person will help another when it doesn't conflict or hamper their own
ability to survive. Living day to day life in Negav distracts the plebs rather effectively and helps leave
the city in the state it's in.

---

I hope its thought out enough. Tomorrow is my last full day at home since I will be leaving on a road trip Friday. I have been trying to get people's opinions, thoughts, etc out via private messages but I decided to post it now because sending another just wouldn't be enough time for the poor soul .

Constructive Criticism please(and thoughts ^.^). To be fairly honest, I'm really paranoid about how south this thread could go.

Without it going into real specifics this is a well thought out idea on how locally developed human charactistis would govern the implementation and practice of the law. The 'survival first' imperative would simplify many cases, though could be easily corrupted.

Overall I like it.

Nice work. It's coherent and, I think, an interesting starting point to flesh out what it actually feels like to live in Negav. (For example, as far as I can recall, this is the first time anyone suggests any sort of election being held in Negav. Further fleshing out of that would include determining who has the right to vote.)

Excellent starting point. It's simple, effective, and gives us a great idea of how the foundation of Negav works.

I like it.

Thanks for the input

As I imagine it, the various districts could even have their own laws, like the united states has national and state laws, so you could be a legal adult in one state but may not be a legal adult in another state. In the same way, maybe other races may have certain rights in one state, and different rights in another. Though Negav IS very small.
(seriously, anyone know how small 90sq miles is? that's like 9x9 miles...)

Just a thought though. I'd have to think more on it...unless someone else wants to pitch in.

I propose an alternative:

Before we get into specific policies and laws, I believe it necessary to concern ourselves with the overall, organisational structure, policy of authority, freedom and attitudes of the Negav government, its subsidiaries, and other political powers, such as guilds.

First up, centralisation or decentralisation of government organisations.

I'd say that the Negav goverment would be quite centralised. That is, there would be just a few government organisations covering the whole of Negav. It is just one city after all.

I disagree with Bael's "Rotes" idea. It's not a bad idea, but I don't think it's a bad idea, I just don't think that Negav would use a system that's practically feudal. It's inefficient, especially for a city.
Feudal systems were used for entire kingdoms; Negav is simply not that big.
A single tax office per tier would easily be able to control all the taxes efficiently.
I think it gives too much independence to the local authorities and independence isn't something that the magiocrats would want to hand over to the people like that. They would be an oligarchy, holding all the power.

Policing
The Negav police would be a fairly centralised authority. There wouldn't be local district police stations. Instead; a few large stations would cover the entire city. I'd say 2 per tier.
This would have the following effects:

Police response to threats would be very well coordinated.
Response time would be longer if there were no units in the area.
The police force would be easy for the magiocrats to control.
The high petty criminality in Negav is due to the lack of local stations.

Essentially, a petty criminal could maybe get away with small things occasionally, but anything larger or more organised would allow the police to respond with overwhelming force.

It would also give justification to the merchants, etc to have more than a few bodyguards.

Lastly; The vishmitals would have their own military police.

Laws
As for laws and the senate, I was of the opinion that Negav was essentially governed by "Noble Republic" kind of system, except that the "Nobles" were spellcasters. The Magiocrats, essentially.

I agree how you've laid out education, except for the taxes going into the pockets of government officials. It may happen, but not to a great extent with a centralised tax office.

I don't think that laws would be made with loopholes. Rather, the merchants and other wealthy business men with large interests with the city would be able to essentially lobby for laws. Not to the extent of our world, since the Magiocrats already have loads of money, but enough so that things go there way more often than not.

There wouldn't be a senate. There's no need for that in an oligarchy.

Healthcare
Due to Felarya's nature, I don't think that there would be much healthcare. What healthcare there is would be run local, independent interests and as a side business at that.
For example:
An apothecary that also does some quick cure potions.
A barber that also sets bones.


Overview
As I said at the beginning, of the post, government organisations would be centralised.

Attention would be given to the wealthy regardless of family background or history rather than any kind of noble class.

Overall, I'd say that the people are Negav are fairly free, but unable to do much about the system unless there's either a lot of them or they have a lot of money.

I don't think there's be a particularly strong "serve thyself first" mentality. Negavians are proud, they'd look out for others to an extent, since if one looks bad they all look bad.

Quote :

As I imagine it, the various districts could even have their own laws, like the united states has national and state laws, so you could be a legal adult in one state but may not be a legal adult in another state. In the same way, maybe other races may have certain rights in one state, and different rights in another. Though Negav IS very small.

Yeah, no. As I said, I don't think that the Magiocrats would let people rule themselves to any extent, too much risk of a local authority getting uppity.

Thanks (was wondering when you'd post)

Centralized government sounds a little better, but with the rotes idea, I was still indenting on just them dealing with politics. If they pass a law through to the Senate, the Senate still has to decide whether or not to use it. If they pass a law through their own district it's not passed, and they cannot enforce it until its official.

Also, there should be a section for guilds, its something I missed when going through somehow. The mages guild might be more like an official branch, probably because one of the magiocrats would be it's head.

Policing I like.

Taxing...well thanks for a lot of that but really you're thinking too naively and utopian. in a place like negav, there probably wont be much internal affairs, the Investigators are the closest thing Negav has to that, and there would be no need or desire to make internal affairs because the government officials are greedy. Plain and simple, they'd pocket funds when they can get away with it. If it gets too obvious, then there'd probably be a riot or revolt of some degree. That'd be a far more effective, yet natural internal affairs.

The Senate would just be the official term, they'd probably all be mages, yeah, but still voted in. Being nobles would just be an extra bit of spice for that part of the system. (could you become a noble?)

But yeah, the citizens would probably have a "help others" over "help thyself first" mentality. The government officials would be the more greedy ones. They want to make sure the city stays intact, but they also want their own fortunes.

I changed some, took out the rotes, and edited the senate (I need a good name for them, for now, I'm using "executives/executors"). There's not that many, probably between 3 and 8 depending on who is judged to be a representative, and how many branches will HAVE a representatives.

I suggest we take AJ's Police section, but add on branches of the police - security police for law enforcement, and emergency police for things like homes collapsing, fires, etc INSTEAD of a fire department.

Negav Law & Politics

Negav's plebeians think more on a day to day, or survival first mentality. The harshness of the wilderness has kept the spirits of the people on a "help yourself first" before anything else. Due to this, the political system runs pretty freely without much drawback.

Districts and Taxes

Negav's districts are managed by supervisors (any interesting names for this position?)
The District Supervisors take the report, the taxes, and any other item of importance with them when they are all gathered to vote and discuss ideas. This is one of the lowest office positions in Negav's political game.

Laws and the Senate

Laws proposed are given to the District Leaders, who take it with them to vote on and discuss for the possibility of passing it on to the Executive Circle. Executives are appointed by the head magiocrat. Each Executive also acts as a judge, and is a member of the circle that judge whether or not a law is valuable enough to be passed on to the Magiocracy for finalizing. Each Executor appoints the District Leaders.
Laws proposed by citizens are rarely passed. Laws proposed by Senators are the ones thatare usually passed by the Magiocracy. Executives are often suckups to their superiors, who even when blatantly corrupt are hardly ever over thrown by a majority vote from the Executive Circle just because they have the ambition of some day getting there themselves, even if it's a pipe dream.

There are few Executives, a couple for each branch of the government (civilians, police, etc.)

Executives also lighten the burden for the Magiocrats, who need to spend time honing their magical abilities, managing their own life outside politics. This is important because the Magiocrats aren't just politicians, whereas the Executive's are.

Magiocracy

This is where every "important" law ends up. What goes on in the Magiocracy is still a mystery, but in the end laws are finalized and set into motion here. The Magiocrats all get in via a test, and whether or not they were previously a senator may not matter even in the slightest. The Magiocracy rotates it's "chairman" once every
10 years, and citizens are given a chance to vote - but ninety-five percent of the time the chairman has already been chosen, and there's only one name on the ballot. The Magiocrats all do deals with the top business owners, institutions, or service branch. On the record one Magiocrat may be the ex-executive of the Investigators, but off the record may still be running it.

Law Psychology

Laws are generally vague, allowing for the intentional use of loopholes by people who run vice circles. Communities with a lot of shady shops and brothels will often be overlooked due to the recognition of the economy these places fuel. Therefore prostitution and anti-sex laws aren't very well specified, and on the occasion a place skirts the lines of the law, and even breaks it, they are usually only given a slap on the
wrist. Only rampant breaking of the law results in a court case, where a Senator is appointed as judge.

Healthcare

Healthcare is rather low, privatized, and usually provided for by various guilds that the taxes help support. Medical supplies are left to the duty of the hospital.

Education

Education falls into branches under military jurisdiction, or the duty of the Mages Guild, who educate the bulk of those who were rich enough to afford it. For this reason, the Mages Guild, and the Negavian Security and Military forces are both given the most money from the government, and make the most profit.
The taxes gathered are often used as a "salary" for the Governmental officials instead, which is why much of the system is hard to access.

Overview

The Political and Economic system is pretty grim, but a "serve thyself first" mentality keeps most people
being able to do much about it. Riots are rare, and only occur when enough people are genuinely angry at
the system. Of course the common person will help another when it doesn't conflict or hamper their own
ability to survive. Living day to day life in Negav distracts the plebs rather effectively and helps leave
the city in the state it's in.

Alright... just gonna put this here before anyone gets carried away.

Negav is not a grim-dark dystopia. It is a vibrant, multispecies and multicultural trade-city. I imagine most Negavians in the middle (where the vast majority of native Negavians actually live) and the high tiers are generally fairly happy and free. The low tier is the more dangerous area, with a lot of transient residents and offworlders, but even then, it is going to have some variance. It isn't all going to be the wild-west, there would be some areas that are a bit safer than others.

Quote :

Education

Education falls into branches under military jurisdiction, or the duty of the Mages Guild, who educate the bulk of those who were rich enough to afford it. For this reason, the Mages Guild, and the Negavian Security and Military forces are both given the most money from the government, and make the most profit.
The taxes gathered are often used as a "salary" for the Governmental officials instead, which is why much of the system is hard to access.

I would not count out smaller, independent schools too. Primarily in the middle tier. Even just teaching literature, the common written language of Negav, the history of the city, the dangers of their world, and mathematics would be extremely important.

I just can't see the military and the mages guild controlling all education. Maybe in the high tier, where the rich kids can enroll in schools operated by them... but not so much within the middle and low tiers. And, as stated before, the middle tier is arguably the most important for the city, as that is where most native Negavians actually live.

Quote :

Healthcare

Healthcare is rather low, privatized, and usually provided for by various guilds that the taxes help support. Medical supplies are left to the duty of the hospital.

I imagine there would be quite a variety of healthcare providers in Negav. Even with immortality, there's still a need to treat serious injuries, to set bones, to deal with parasitic infections, poisoning and more. There are likely quite a few smaller clinic scattered around, either using modern-style medicine or magical cures, potions and such. The only big, organized hospital I could see would perhaps be one run by the Isolon University. Maybe a learning hospital for prospective healers and apothecaries. Of course, only high-tier residents would likely have access to that.

You have a point about education. Honestly I've always thought education would be big. There's tons of stuff to learn, but would the magiocrats put money into that? If they did, people would be more educated, and the more educated people are, the more of a threat they are to oligarchy/monarchy governments.

negav might not be grim dark, but I think it would be very clean, yet have a grungy feel to it, though that's a bit more ascetically speaking.

Healthcare might actually be a bit more diverse than people give it credit for. Just because you cant get diseases, doesn't mean that people wont have a need for them. Therapeutic massages, Chiropractics, those types of medical things would also be used to. They'd probably have to be established in certain centers though. Negav doesn't have big enough mileage for it to hold individual buildings. They'd all be in associated centers and stuff.

Just remember, not everything needs government funding to happen. Especially in a city like Negav. If people see a niche, they'll set something up themselves. I imagine most education in Negav is done through privately-funded schools, set up by individuals or groups of individuals. Maybe even a small "educators alliance" who have pooled their funds to set up schools in the middle district, or something.

Negav is all about entrepreneurship and trade.

Honestly, the Magiocrats don't have much to fear from even an educated city. They aren't overly oppressive or dictatorial. They keep the city safe, and they handle a lot of off-world trade. So long as you don't become a threat to either of those, they really shouldn't have much cause to care about you.

I don't think the Magiocrats, by and large, are a bunch of evil corrupt big-bads. They rose up to overthrow an inept king who nearly ran the city into the ground. They're revolutionaries. I imagine some may have settled in to bureaucracy and are more focused on business and trade now, but there's probably quite a few older and newer members that are fairly idealistic, and believe they are keeping the populace safe.

True. Next chance I get, I'll have to edit the education and policing sections.

Education

Education falls into branches under military jurisdiction, or the duty of the Mages Guild, who educate the bulk of those who were rich enough to afford it. For this reason, the Mages Guild, and the Negavian Security and Military forces are both given the most money from the government, and make the most profit.

However, there are a lot of private schools that vary in wealth and quality based on where they're located, and who has funded and set them up. Non profit schools are exceedingly rare outside of the government, however, but regardless, there's plenty of learning.

Students seen to be magically inclined are often given scholarships and allowed to attend the schools run by the Mages Guild.

The taxes gathered are often used as a "salary" for the Governmental officials instead, which is why much of the system is hard to access.

Policing

Policing is divided up into the Security Division, and the Emergency Response Division, (NPER - Negav Police Emergency Response NPSD - Negav Police Security Division).

The Negav police would be a fairly centralised authority. There wouldn't be local district police stations. Instead; a few large stations would cover the entire city. About two or three stations would be placed in each Tier. This enables -

-Police response to threats would be very well coordinated.
-Response time would be longer if there were no units in the area.
-The police force would be easy for the Magiocrats to control.
-The high petty criminality in Negav is due to the lack of local stations.

Merchants would also have their own bodyguards, and the Vishmitals have their own Military Police.

--

Instead of reposting everything, I just typed up the areas changed. What does everyone think?

credit goes to AnimeJunkie for most of the policing section.
credit goes to rcs619 for some help with education.

I agree, I don't think it should be always a case of 'controlled in militarized' or 'controlled by the rich' and generally a very suppressive social structure. I know we all have our own ideas, but this dystopian concept pops up so often in Felarya works that I can't help but wonder if I missed something.

I mean I get it, life Felarya is supposed to be hell, and I agree. But why does it have to be so obvious? All it says to me is "Not only are we all complete bastards, but we don't even try to hide it because we think we can get away with it, and are always astounded when it backfires, which a lot of the time it mostly does"

And why would anyone seriously stay put if the ruling structure acts this way? The wonderful befits of Felarya just wouldn’t be worth it if your stuck between hungry preds and an system that clearly doesn't give a damn.

My idea of it should work is the human ruling system would still function for their own agendas, but at least they do it behind your back. They manipulate you, give you freedom and options to make you like them and want to work for them. Rather than dictators that would spend most their efforts crushing rebels all the time. I would prefer it if it was like normal politics, Asskissing and sneaky. Not the North Korea kind, nothing but crazy controlling bullies.