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dragon808tr
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PostSubject: Felarya Shrink Rays   Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:24 pm

Hey people. I was thinking about something, would Felarya have shrink rays?

I think that they would, considering that IRL Shrinking tech most likely exists (I'm one of those people that beleive that our tech is actually way more advanced than it seems. And A shrink ray already exists, but is in goverment hands).

Even if you don't beleive that, a shrink ray in Felarya could be made by using fairy magic through a gun of some kind (Or possibly getting a fairy to do it, but she would probably eat you soon after).

Also, Negav may have them, as their tech looks pretty futuristic from what I've seen.

What do you think?
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:37 pm

Why would you want to use a shrink ray in the first place. First of all, while fairy magic is powerful, but even it has its limits, it can't easily shrink creatures whose original size is too big, or even shrink them at all, which basically encompasses all creatures you'd want to use them on. To make it work properly on anything you'd want it to use would require humans to somehow be able to surpass fairies in shrinking magic, which needless to say, not going to happen anytime soon. Furthermore, given Negav's culture, a tool like this would be banned immediately and crackdowns on any tech that could possibly replicate it would be ridiculous. Why would you let something that can simulate the most dreaded ability of fairies loose in the city when you live in fear of fairies were it not for the giant crystal atop the city's tallest tower?

Also, using "fairy magic through a gun"? Wouldn't that require, oh I don't know, a fairy to make the thing? You know, the one creature almost everybody in Negav is absolutely terrified of and would try to kill on the spot if possible?
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:42 pm

Oh, I probably should have been more clear sweatdrop I meant as a human vs human weapon (Or human sized creatures) It would obviously be illegal by Negav's "Laws" But you never know which rich person may have one.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Sun Apr 12, 2015 4:00 pm

Pretty sure they wouldn't make exceptions. I know Negav's nobility aren't a friendly bunch, Lesona is pretty much everything that's wrong with the aristocracy, but why would they want a shrink ray? What advantage would it give them over other means of defense? At best it would be a novelty or some kind of tool for very specific jobs... which would already be redundant because tiny people exist and live in the city.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Sun Apr 12, 2015 6:25 pm

Well if you needed someone to "Dissapear" You shrink them, and feed them to a neko or eat them. Beacuse who checks poop for human remains?
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Sun Apr 12, 2015 6:51 pm

And this handy-dandy spell doesn't work because...? Or a spear through the chest? Or anything for that matter? There are many better ways to dispose of a body without having to resort to the lowest common denominator if you just stop and think. Trying to shoehorn vore, even in Felarya, just to adhere to the fetish is something I learned over the years that you just should not do. Something should feel like it fits above all else, and shrink rays as a weapon in Negav just don't make a lick of sense once you start to think about how quite literally every other destructive spell or man portable weapon in existence are far more practical and straightforward at what they do.

Also, nice of you to bring up nekos, they are the exact reason why such technology would be banned on sight. While it's better today than it was in the yesteryears, humans still are fairly uneasy around nekos since their feeding habits make them little different from the predators they both fear and hate. This kind of technology would open quite sensitive wounds among some people. Furthermore, as it would show that some of them aren't above using such a device for selfish needs, which could lead up to prejudice toward nekos could be on the rise again as a result. It's bad for humans and it's bad for nekos. I don't think anyone in the city wants that.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:03 pm

dragon808tr wrote:
Beacuse who checks poop for human remains?
X-ray machines.

There may be hypertech in Negav, I guess- there's Vishmitali after all. So it's not unthinkable that they have shrink rays, there's been stranger things. But if we limit the discussion to saying "this could exist", we're not going to go very far, would we?

At any rate, shrink rays do not have any solid reasons to be available. Surely in an RP or story there may be one, but beyond that, Shady's point stands: there's just no need for them. If it's not intended for defense, it's intended for offense or utility, and there are better options. It's not like vore is the only thing that makes people disappear.



dragon808tr wrote:
I'm one of those people that beleive that our tech is actually way more advanced than it seems. And A shrink ray already exists, but is in goverment hands

We are pleased to correct your misconception. Shrink rays do not exist, citizen. Carry on politely. terminator
He knows too much. Frank, contact Judge Brenham and get me a search warrant for the x-rays of his poop.

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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:27 pm

dragon808tr wrote:
Hey people. I was thinking about something, would Felarya have shrink rays?

I think that they would, considering that IRL Shrinking tech most likely exists (I'm one of those people that beleive that our tech is actually way more advanced than it seems. And A shrink ray already exists, but is in goverment hands).

Finally somebody who makes sense! What a shame now that some beautiful, tall agent lady will show up at your door and show you just how real these Shrink Rays are Evil laugh .....By blasting you with one then putting you in gerbil cage for the rest of your life with all the other "believers". Did thee not watch the X-Files? Nothing but bad stuff happens to the "Moulders' of the universe cause they foolishly anounce their crusade to the world like Nedd Starrk from Game of Thrones. <.< Morons.

On a real note there's probably everything from Tesla styled Deathray to Phasers on Felarya but most of the locals deal in magic. If you wanted you could hire a Deluran or Vishie to build a Shrink Ray buuut the Negavian Government wouldn't take too well to that. I'm sure there's certain laws prohibiting even using shrink spells in the city except with certain permits. Then again Negav Law still needs article in the wiki if I remember right.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 12:10 pm

People, you are doing that thing again where you shoot down new ideas with bogus reasons. terminator

Dragon808tr, I think that shrink rays can exist, but shouldn't. Now, the 'how' is easy. Even if people say that Negav is all about magic, a wand would work, or you could use fairywings as a catalyst--like how in RL we use insect antennae instead of sensors because we simply can not create anything as fine as nature provides...yet.

However, Felarya is about vore, and while it would help with humanoid voring, it would prevent most others. Why are humans so easily eaten in the jungle? Because they are slow. But now, a ninja could carry an entire expedition in his backpack. Or kill preds by having that whole team fire nukes--possible after enlarging, depending on the physics.

Isolation is also a big part of Felarya, as right now no trade is possible--I hate you pred sense Very Mad --but a ninja could transport a whole caravan's worth of shrunken goods.

Finally, they could shrink down giant preds. Yes, one fairy can often not shrink down a giant, but heap enough together and it works. A team with shrink rays could tackle any dungeon, and vore Crisis herself.

Admittedly, I did use 5-minute shrink potions in one of my own threads, figuring that the time and ingestion limit would make it less setting breaking.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 12:48 pm

Scryangi wrote:
People, you are doing that thing again where you shoot down new ideas with bogus reasons.
The reasoning provided has been perfectly legitimate.

Scryangi wrote:
Dragon808tr, I think that shrink rays can exist, but shouldn't. Now, the 'how' is easy. Even if people say that Negav is all about magic, a wand would work, or you could use fairywings as a catalyst--like how in RL we use insect antennae instead of sensors because we simply can not create anything as fine as nature provides...yet.
Fairywings would be a very expensive catalyst. You would need far too much in the development of the ray to make it worthwhile. Wands are too common to be used, or else human mages would have mastered the ways by now.


Scryangi wrote:
However, Felarya is about vore, and while it would help with humanoid voring, it would prevent most others. Why are humans so easily eaten in the jungle? Because they are slow. But now, a ninja could carry an entire expedition in his backpack. Or kill preds by having that whole team fire nukes--possible after enlarging, depending on the physics.

Humanoid voring tends to be the main issue when it is humanoids that would be using said ray, don't be so quick to brush it off. There are a whole host of reasons be humans are incompetent in the face of felaryan predators, the least of which is speed. In fact, the most successful ones are exceedingly slow and remain unnoticed. If a single ninja carries a whole team, as soon as he is captured, the rest of his team is too. If the entire team is competent, the loss of one member is not necessarily crippling. Nukes are not to be used in close proximity unless the intent is suicide.


Scryangi wrote:
Finally, they could shrink down giant preds. Yes, one fairy can often not shrink down a giant, but heap enough together and it works. A team with shrink rays could tackle any dungeon, and vore Crisis herself.

A team with shrink rays could have easily spent the resources on a whole host of more effective self defense paraphernalia.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:14 pm

Reasons so far are this: expensive, redundant, dangerous to own, and dangerous to create. Given that we know that fairy wings are a super rare but available component, it can be done. If then used to gain a monopoly on trade and exploration, you are also rich and influential now, thus can get more.

Because of stupid overpowered pred sense I fail to see how one can be slow and unnoticed. Going slow through the jungle means exposure to all the not-giant dangers.

And if you think that by capturing the carrier you disable the inhabitants, than I invite you pick up a wasp hive, or in this case the literal army base in his backpack.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:16 pm

I share the same sentiment with Evil Genius.  Except for two things.

Quote :
Felarya is about vore

I will contest this to the moon.  I've come to see Felarya as a setting with a lot of untapped potential for lore and stories who just happens to have vore.  I have barely shown vore in my main story because I tend to see it emphasized too much at the cost of stories that shows life in locations like Negav or Chioita City.  I think such stories deserve to be more spotlighted, because after a while, all stories about giants eating just blend together and become dull.

Quote :
one fairy can often not shrink down a giant, but heap enough together and it works

Um, bullcrap?  Where did you get that idea?  Where is your proof that it's how it works?  I don't think spells work the same way as using more water to put out a bigger fire.

Also, several holes in your reasonings:

1. Where is your proof that fairy wings would work like that as a component? And even if they do, what makes you think a single pair would be enough?

2. Ever heard of camouflage? Hell, this is the entire Dryads' schtick, they're immobile, which I don't think you can be slower than that, but are deadly because they're so hard to spot, and once the opportunity to nab you has come, you're dead.

3. Wasps can fly. Wasp nests can't exactly be squeezed with just one hand. Your little ninja dude with its tiny ass backpack sure as hell can, and if the backpack is squeezed too hard, everyone inside has now been reduced to the consistency of chunky salsa.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:42 pm

Shady, I wholeheartedly agree with you about the vore killing the realism and potential of Felarya. However, it is cannon, proven, and as long as preds can be made more into the hybrid animals that they started as, and not demi-gods, then I will gladly appease both the lore and the vore fans.

First off, where is your proof that what I say can not exist? Since we can not go there and prove it, we should assume that anything is possible, and use Occam's Razor. Fairy magic comes from wings.  By keeping a body part alive we can let it continue to function--see RL medicine. Like some kind of positive necromancy, or stimulating certain nerves, or mind controlling a fairy, or whatever, we could do it.

Camouflage? Good idea, and I would very much like to have cloaked caravans and cities in the jungle. I still doubt we can have 'easy protection methods'. Remember how you fought them in other threads? 'It's about the struggle to survive!'.

And you forget one thing about shrinking: it can be dispelled which thus releases them whole and ready to fight. Also, perhaps the shrinking allows for denser plating, since it's now lighter and smaller, thus you can have many adamantium walls inside the lining of your backpack?

Ps: remember that I oppose the idea of giving humans access to shrink rays, and do thus not endorse it. Why are we even arguing?
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:06 pm

This shouldn't even be a argument in the first place. Honestly this is kind of silly, felarya can be silly as well as serious. I mean really...I can see this idea being used at least comedic. A rare occasion of a mad scientist/alchemist messing with multiple variations of magictech to make something like that and then messes with what ever the law or authority saids because of shits and giggles (people do this irl and make some odd wonders out of it) same can be applied here. However i'm with stabs. It just needs to be in the right context. I don't imagine this being handed out to civilians or "your regular people" intentionally, but i can see the development happening by those daring to expand boundaries for personal fulfillment. This idea isn't bad. So like scry said, instead of shooting it down talk about limitation (like you have been but with creative purposes) and also what you could do with something like this to make interesting stories or scenarios for RP's story writing and such...This world has magic and science, it's very frontier and survival oriented on a serious note. So I can see a few ambitious people making something like this if they have the brains and the know how to do it. But that depends importantly on how the creator wants to create that for the fulfillment of imagination of the readers/spectators and themselves within good reason of entertainment and creative indulgence.

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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:16 pm

Because you put forth arguments on how it would work and what it would do, which other people think would not work, therefore they are voicing their own opinion. It's Debate 101.

Also, the predator sense isn't the problem. The problem is your unwillingess to bend the rules to make a story better. Want an example? My naga Hierry doesn't use a predator sense to find preys. She uses her tongue, which is forked like a snake, to detect tastes in the air. Want another example? I had two unnamed fairies spot a human by sight, not having noticed her first because I thought it would be more interesting that way. Don't be afraid to bend the rules to fit your story. I do that all the time.

The predator sense is a pretty archaic concept from when Felarya was pure vore, and it is yet another example of an old concept clashing with the new ones. The way I see it is that it works kind of like Detect Magic in D&D. Detect Magic when used right away just tells you that there's a magical aura there or not. It does not tell you where said aura is, how strong it is, or how many there actually are. You gotta sit down and keep concentrating to find that out. Thing is, that tricks is normally exclusive to races that are strongly magic oriented, meaning mostly fairies, deerataurs, and nagas, though in the case of nagas, I think that should come late in their life, around the same time they suddenly develop magic. All other races, like harpies, dridders and mermaids, well they gotta rely on something else.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:22 pm

Arvey, thank you putting it into words better than I can. ^_^

Shady, in case you did not read it the first two times, I'll repeat it a third time, and hope it is clear now: I like realism, and expanding upon ideas.

I  detest pred sense and how it is both boring and setting disrupting. I also wish to explore how shrinking can be used. Even if  human controlled shrinking can not be made canon in this setting, it can be in others so I like to talk about the possible uses.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:05 pm

Shocked Woah! Umm... this escalated quickly. First off, calm down a sec.

Second off. I think a Felarya shrink ray is possible at least (See Anna's ray gun weapon from tome 2). Sure it would be a pain in the ass to build either via fairy power or magic/tech ways. Also said weapon would only go to Negav's wealthy. Most likely those rich people involved in the tiny trade (Beacuse they can just shrink people and then sell them or use them).

To respond to earlier arguments, sure a spell like Obliterate or something to transport a human to a place with predators could work just the same. But sometimes, someone might want to get a more personal revenge. I get about not having vore just for vore. Felarya is vore based, but not everything has to revolve around it. Personally, i'd like to see how daily life is run in Negav. It would make for an interesting story. (As well as animal cultures).

Also, some gmen came to me today, shrunk me, and now i'm in the feeding pail of some hungry horse! HELP!

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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:40 pm

Don't worry dragon808tr, you can lead a horse to water but you can't... Uh, make him eat little people? Wink

I would say if someone desperately needed a shrink ray gun as a plot device in their story (not that I have any idea how that situation would arise!) it could reasonably be allowed - either as a piece of high tech experimental Negavian/off-world kit, or a weird magicky kind of hybrid tool - as long as it wasn't crazily over-powered. It doesn't seem like something that'd be commonplace, just because as discussed before there doesn't seem much need for it, but that's not to say it couldn't be found. It could smack a bit of deus ex machina if used unwisely though!
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Thu Jun 18, 2015 11:58 am

If people can't think of legitimate reasons they want things to be smaller, they have severely limited imaginations. Hell one of the most used things in DnD, the Bag of Holding, is based on fitting things into a space where they have no business fitting.

Escape, carrying capacity, trap avoidance, squeezing through tight spaces are just off the top of my head of why an adventurer would want such a power.

I don't think shrink rays would be easy to come by at all, even shrinking potions or dust would be hard to make.

A more complex situation is someone wanting to get rich by selling "Tinies" to nekos. But you would have to imagine the costs of the machine or potions would far outweigh the profits.

However, I dislike putting down the idea that shrinking someone down and feeding him to a neko is a terrible way to get rid of someone, because murder is not always just about getting someone dead or getting away with it, it can be about the way the person is to die. I'm sure being fed to a neko is right on up there in the cruel and humiliating list.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Thu Jun 18, 2015 1:07 pm

Grave wrote:
I'm sure being fed to a neko is right on up there in the cruel and humiliating list.
Seeing how this can be incredibly sexy for the neko, the tiny (well, depending on their preferences Razz ) and the one feeding the neko i doubt they'd refuse to use that kind of technique in the long run. Also, Fairies do that already, and what has been thought once, might happen again. Reynke WILL do that a lot~

The fact you leave no body behind is super useful as well, and I imagine that happening A LOT within the negavian underground and the pit where the black market for tinies thrives and the omnipresent neko mafia is in its homeland.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:03 pm

Amaroq wrote:
Grave wrote:
I'm sure being fed to a neko is right on up there in the cruel and humiliating list.
Seeing how this can be incredibly sexy for the neko, the tiny (well, depending on their preferences Razz ) and the one feeding the neko i doubt they'd refuse to use that kind of technique in the long run. Also, Fairies do that already, and what has been thought once, might happen again. Reynke WILL do that a lot~

The fact you leave no body behind is super useful as well, and I imagine that happening A LOT within the negavian underground and the pit where the black market for tinies thrives and the omnipresent neko mafia is in its homeland.

^ALL MY YES! I VOLUNTEER AS TINY TRIBUTE!

Ahem, this also makes a lot of logical sense. IRL serial killers typically use acid to get rid of the bodies to avoid being tracked down. Having personally worked with dangerous acids myself, i know it wouldn't take much to get rid of a body via acid. Human stomach acid alone is strong enough to digest a razor blade to noting, so a tiny would easily digest, unless he manages to escape!
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Thu Jun 18, 2015 7:47 pm

Hmmmm this is kind of related, but do tom thumb tinies have a different taste and smell than humans? Like would a neko be able to tell the difference, or sniff out a tiny in a room of humans? Would she be able to taste the difference in a shrunken human or tom thumb?
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:08 am

Grave wrote:
Hmmmm this is kind of related, but do tom thumb tinies have a different taste and smell than humans? Like would a neko be able to tell the difference, or sniff out a tiny in a room of humans? Would she be able to taste the difference in a shrunken human or tom thumb?

I think that each species have their own smell, so nekos can distinguish between humans and tomthumbs, or we will have a lot of nekos pounce on humans. When seeing a shruken human, if the neko is not too hungry, she may try to find out why this "tomthumb" does not smell like a tomthumb at all. If she eats a shruken human, there may be a chance that the human may return to his orginal size inside her stomach, which will endanger her. Even if there is only a hand left inside her stomach, the suddenly enlarged hand may cause a lot of stomach trouble.

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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:20 am

Maybe the shrunken prey gets a piece of fairy magical jewelry wrapped around to keep them tiny. Like a tiny collar that cant be removed without a pair of scissors, which should be unavaiable to the tasty treat in question.
Or they are kept shrunken by applying more shrink magic to them everytime while they are kept imprisoned, until their time to shine... ehr, the time of consumption.

Also remember that shrinking rays dont necessarily shrink momentarily, but possibly permanent. only fairy magic is temporary, it doesnt have to be ANY kind of shrinking. Since a shrinking ray is not a permanent, staying magic but a physical effect, its hard to reason WHY someone would grow back in the first place.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Shrink Rays   Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:41 pm

Yeah, I was kinda referring to some old school shrink rays where one blast shrinks you, and the second one (Or the gun is set to grow you back) takes you back to your normal size!

I wonder though, what if there are willing humans to shrink or ones that allow it to happen to give their family lots of money? (Kind of like the short story "A Modest Proposal" Where in impoverished Ireland (Due to famine) There was a proposal to raise kids like chickens, and sell them to rich people as food, the family in turn, got money. Perhaps something like that.) Or maybe, a human and Neko girlfriend want to get very close, forever!

(I'm having way too much fun with this! I love the idea, if anyone wants to talk further or Rp on it, let me know)

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