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 What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?

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Shady Knight
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 4:55 am

I disagree with your explanation, vixen, and I also disagree that the way the wiki presents how souls are treated to be full of loopholes.  It's honestly simple: A soul is eaten by a succubus or an angel, the soul is then digested like a normal body and is destroyed.  It doesn't need to be more complicated than that.  Thywolf's excerpt said more with fewer words than you did.

Yours and hat's idea seem to be complex for the sake of being complex without really adding anything.  So, from what I gathered, if a mortal was eaten by Menyssan let's say, his soul will then reappear in the mortal realm and have transformed into a succubus magnet or something.  It will then be eaten over and over by succubus over time, respawning weaker each time until it finally breaks down.  My question is: why?  This seems like too many unnecessary steps when it could be only as simple as the mortal's body is digested along with its soul because demon.  Or alternatively, the soul remains trapped inside the Succubus stomach because it's only a fake body until she returns to Hell where she returns to her normal state, at which point the soul is being digested again.  Since ghosts are close enough to souls, they are subject to those same rules.  The sauna thing I can't help but just roll my eyes looking at it.  Once again, making something complex just for the sake of it.  The sauna is just a hot spring for fire succubi, it's only there for them to relax.  It even says so in the picture's description: it's a vacation spot.

I have a policy when I do world building that if you can't sum up an aspect of the world, that if you can't drill down to its core idea without needing paragraphs and paragraphs as you did, vixen, then you need to go back to the drawing board, because you what gave us is an expodump, and expodumps are bad.  Just like drugs are bad.

I would like to take that time to bring attention to something. Notice how only Hell brings up what they do with souls that are of lesser value to them. Not once is it mentioned in Heaven's entry what they do with souls that are grayer for a lack of a better term. This seems to highlight an interesting difference in ideology/culture. Hell seems to only care about the finest quality soul. Anything that doesn't meet that standard is essentially burned in a living incinerator. I hesitate to call it a Darwinian approach because I'm quite positive that wouldn't be the appropriate use for that term. Heaven, on the other hand, seems to try to make a use out of those grayer souls, essentially trying to refine them so they become pure enough to satisfy most of the angels there, though this probably come at a cost of not getting quite as much out of the souls that are already of high quality.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:51 am

@ Shadyknight, want to rephrase that with out being a dick? I'll give you a chance to do that with a rebutle. And did i really give an exodump? I'm just giving and explantion that's an idea, you can disagree with it if you like, but again don't be a dick about it. It's just an explanation through creativity. I didn't necessarily do anything wrong either. Also you and I have a different opinon on ghost and spirits that from what i seen from world creating from examples of different universes can be seperate. Being honest here, min is simple to the fact if you were to reanimate someone. If not, then yours is valid. Also your not really stating how complex that "fake" body is. From what i get it's an avatar for the mortal realm, how complex is that avatar, enough to emulate feelings as if that were their body 100% from what it seems. So then is that an avatar or their body right then and there, we'd like to say the former but wait that makes things more simpler even though the idea of it is complicated. Like your saying, But the reason we accept it is because it's a good creative vaule to go on. I'm just wondering if my explanation was for for a specific reason. Again you don't need to be pompus ass about it. A tip for you when criticizing someone or something, state what can be good about it, then say why you think it's awkward or a not so fitting idea. For being a world build if you can't compare that way, that mean some of your aspects and polices can be labeled as myopic.

Shady knight wrote:
I would like to take that time to bring attention to something. Notice how only Hell brings up what they do with souls that are of lesser value to them. Not once is it mentioned in Heaven's entry what they do with souls that are grayer for a lack of a better term. This seems to highlight an interesting difference in ideology/culture. Hell seems to only care about the finest quality soul. Anything that doesn't meet that standard is essentially burned in a living incinerator. I hesitate to call it a Darwinian approach because I'm quite positive that wouldn't be the appropriate use for that term. Heaven, on the other hand, seems to try to make a use out of those grayer souls, essentially trying to refine them so they become pure enough to satisfy most of the angels there, though this probably come at a cost of not getting quite as much out of the souls that are already of high quality.

I like that difference. I got a hint they were supposed to be like that. You could say in a sense if i were a predator that's resident. Finest quality=Self gratification (hellverse) Support-fullfillment (Heavenverse) Though i think that distinction was unintentional but it's a good adversity. Whith my explanation i just generalized it. Your giving specifics and that's your incentive. And they aren't bad specifics either, quite good actually.


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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:35 am

Sure, I can: I find your idea hard to follow and way too complicated in how wordy it is. So, basically, if a mortal is eaten by a succubus while on the mortal realm, somehow is soul goes back to the mortal realm, where it will somehow attract more succubi to come and eat him, and that cycle will repeat, with the soul getting weaker every time, until it finally dies for good. I don't see at all why it needs to be like that, it seems like too many unnecessary steps when it can just be as simple and easy to follow as "Soul is eaten, soul dies". I see no loopholes in Thywolf's excerpt.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:43 am

If that's seriously a hard concept for you, or complicated, you need to take basic creative writing classes, bub.
also, Hell is a punishment, what kinda punishment would "one time in the pool" be??? Hitler gets to squirm for 30 minutes and then... blissful oblivion with no guilt or pain? Really now.
and this ties into the over arcing vore theme of Felarya, it literally follows the fuel of tHe world. More vore! Yay
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:54 am

Just because it has more vore doesn't make it better, bub, nor does making it more complex make it more creative.  Also, you missed the point Felarya Hell entirely, or rather, you decided not to read the excerpt Thywolf kindly put up.  The souls that get eaten by the Succubi are those that are not so dark, i.e. not very valuable.  They dispose of the low value soul so that they can focus more attention on tormenting and punishing the ones that are much darker because they're more valuable and they want to get the most out of those.

Plus, this mentality to always go back to vore is one of Felarya's trappings that stifles creativity.  In essence, by having to tie yourself back to it, you're preventing the setting from growing past its roots, therefore limiting its potential.


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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 8:45 am

I'm gonna side with Shady here... for all the wrong reasons.

I'm not a big fan of succubi not being able to do away with your eternal aspect: them destroying your soul is harsh, unfair, and leaves a lurking sense of empty dread, just the way I like it. Besides, it wouldn't make sense for succubi to vore you if you'd simply reappear. Besides, if being vored won't do away with you, what the fuck will?

Felarya emphasizes the LETHAL vore, and being eaten by a succubus isn't exactly standard punishment either. We can probably make punishment in hell being everything that happens before, nobody says you've got to be eaten by a succubus right away. Why not wait a week? Or 5000 years? Or a million? In fact, is there nothing else that can eat your soul? Some plant, or a strange beast that looks like Alucard drew it while on cocaine during an impressionist phase?

As for some Hitler guy squirming for 30 minutes... I like that idea. Having the guy endure the same thing as everyone else in spite of all his deeds, facing him with nothing but sheer meaninglessness... is delicious to a nihilist like me.

But if anything were to return after being vored, I'd rather it were not regeneration but recombination: impersonal and as different as possible from the souls that were vored. I'd like for the eternal aspects of their meals to be corrupted and twisted beyond ALL recognition, if anything is to endure at all beyond the memory of your deeds.

If people were to be capable of regenerating after vore, I'd rather it were the exception, not the rule.

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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 9:22 am

I think, I like Shady Knight´s and Stabs´ Explanation the most. Despite this, I (and my Characters of Course) will stay with this Theory: Anything ripped apart or simply being killed before getting eaten has a Chance to be reborn - because the Way for the Soul is free. Anything eaten alive by something self aware and thinking - is doomed, because a Soul trapped in another one can´t transgress - and will be dissolved completely (perhaps at once, perhaps over a long Peroid of Time) - and You don´t need Succubi to do this Kind of Job.
They should nicely stay in Hell torturing Uncle Adolph, Pol Pot, Idi Amin and other equally delightful Specimen of our Race. And Angels should do their Job, too - kicking in Butts of bad living Guys - and somethimes helping good living ones.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 9:36 am

I believe there's common sense issues when it comes to harming society over all. Going to hell should be reserved for those who know what they're doing is wrong, whether or not they believe in something after death. Or if they've been given signs of any kind.

This is relevant because not all people go to hell normally. What determines who goes to hell after all? Succubi could easily snatch someone in Felarya and bring them down into the pits of hell, eat them, and that would do it. They'd be gone.

A helpless innocent person, and that's just cruel. For everything that hell can do, heaven should be able to counter, and vice versa. Thats why I believe in a system that allows souls to go back and forth in some form. After all, we're talking about the forces of creation here. They probably have unrestricted control of reality.

Still, being dead in Felarya's afterlife pretty much already speaks that you've been eaten (lethally). In our creative minds, why would we condemn an innocent soul to nothingness? If they deserved hell thats one thing. Being in the afterlife is permanent enough for me. I have extreme personal discomfort with anything beyond that.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 10:15 am

Archmage_Bael wrote:
This is relevant because not all people go to hell normally. What determines who goes to hell after all? Succubi could easily snatch someone in Felarya and bring them down into the pits of hell, eat them, and that would do it. They'd be gone.

A helpless innocent person, and that's just cruel. For everything that hell can do, heaven should be able to counter, and vice versa. Thats why I believe in a system that allows souls to go back and forth in some form. After all, we're talking about the forces of creation here. They probably have unrestricted control of reality.

Life isn't fair, why should the afterlife be any different? This is Abrahamic mythos intervention; Heaven and Hell don't need to be separate, nor do they need to be opposites in nature. Pleasure and pain are both the same, the interpretation of the result is the only difference in how your mind perceives them.

There is not, nor do I believe there should be, an established system of checks and balances to determine what goes where. Heaven and Hell are not 'destinations' so much as they are 'other planes of existence' - particularly in regards to Lydus. The loss of the physical form for the spiritual one is a catch-22 no matter how you look at it. The determination of value of a soul, as to how it would help Heaven or Hell ( not the soul itself - why would they care what you think is your right? Egocentrism abounds... ) should be the job of psychopomps - which are angels and succubi. One would imagine that your arrival in a realm of Heaven or Hell would likely be due to your affinity for that realm which attracts that realm's pyschopomps to you.

I do not see it as being Heaven's or Hell's job to counter one another with regards to who get's snatched in such a scenario, unless it's some caveat of the Treaty of Tar'manthe. Heaven and Hell are concerned with their own affairs - souls are just a means to an end for these goals - and we presume the fighting betweenst them is a resources war. Why would we assume Heaven or Hell is about what the souls themselves want? What a soul experiences in either domain is a byproduct of that domain, and what its inhabitants enjoy doing ( as is noted ).

Either side would only care if they felt they were being stiffed. Common souls amount to water under the bridge, and controlling the influx of said material to one zone or the other is merely a matter of how 'proactive' one side is at the time. The more proactive the various sides are ( because we have multiple Heavenly and Hellish worlds that could vie for a particular soul, if it attracted their attention ), the more likely a war scenario is to occur.

This then allows for the vore elements where angels / succubi appear in Felarya and eat someone - the outcome will be the same regardless of the location I would think. Why would what happens in their innards be different simply because of where they are currently located? In such a case, a pyschopomp would be expected to intervene ( if such an intervention were particularly warranted due to the 'value' of the soul in question ). Again, angels / succubi have tastes and can also determine the value of a soul ( based on what we've seen in Karbo's works ) so they already act in a pyschopomp capacity in that regard - if the soul has no value to their side, why can't it be someone else's food? Why would they care what happens to it? There are worlds upon worlds in both Heaven and Hell, you're not going to pull the attention of all of them. They help themselves, either way. That I think, is the more appropriate mindset for these creatures.



To the original topic; most already know my preferences. I see it as a more final end, where things do not come back as they once were. Energy is never destroyed, merely transformed. Ghosts / spirits are just energy that resembles a physical form of a previous entity. That energy works just as well providing carbs for a succubus' body as it does sustaining itself.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 3:34 pm

*Jaw hits floor* Wow, this is defiantly my best thread to date! Thanks everyone!

My opinion on this so far, would be that the souls might wait in hell (as in kept somewhere to be eaten later beacuse souls would not require anything to keep them around, they simplly are) Then souls would be taken out of this storage to be eaten or used in Messayan's chess game. Which was Noted by Chays at the beginning of her house having the best souls beacuse of its influence.

As for a soul digested in hell, i still think it would go to the hell collective or nothingness. The same would be true of heaven but just being in a realm(s) and doing whatever that soul wanted. I think there is 1 possible pred in heaven, but it is rare and would be hunted by angels.

One note to keep in mind for everyone; Felarya is seperate from our understanding in terms of relegion. Like our world, Felarya has many other relegions. I don't think that any of them beleive in any true reincarnation, although the tree people beleive they become one with giant tree. In any case, quite interesting but just make sure this dosen't delve into personal religious beliefs. Ive seen how bad it can get if it comes to that.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Wed Apr 22, 2015 7:15 pm

Dragon wrote:
Like our world, Felarya has many other relegions. I don't think that any of them believe in any true reincarnation

Karbo did a 'Word of author' and banished reincarnation in Felarya I'm pretty sure.


Personally I think all your viewpoints are great but for me? I believe soul can never be destroyed only changed and should be thought of the same as what happens to a person's body when they are consumed: absorption. When Milly, heh bet you thought I'd use Crisis as n example, eats you her body dissolves you but you don't go away completely. Most of you ends up becoming a part of her luscious body. So in turn I posit that any soul eaten and digested by a succubi is now a part of the succubi. What part? Well sense succubus are constructed, theirbodies anyway, beings it may be just more magical energy to power said form, it could be you become a bit of that "body" or simply a tiny bit of her soul forever being merged with her and...Hey! Maybe ht explains why some succubi get less evil, or at least less psychotic, and maybe start to befreind mortals....or perhaps that's just an amusing rumor they started to nab pure hearted souls and then have the ultimate pleasure of corrupting them? It's all up to the author really till Karbo says otherwise...but still up to the author in reality =p
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 8:18 am

ravaging vixen wrote:

A punishment in Hell is meant to be eternal, and as such, reliving your worst (dying) moment once, if vored, or whatever other punishments exist, doesn't seem like a fitting thing.

Who says it's "meant to be eternal"? Smile This isn't the Christian concept of Hell (which personally I've always found completely disproportionate, by the way). The Hell that we have in relation to Felarya isn't "meant to be" anything other than what we (or Karbo) make of it.

I'm fine with what's currently in the wiki. Souls are "reincarnated" (in the literal meaning of the word) before being fed to succubi, and are then digested like any normal, physical, material food. Their soul is snuffed out, forever, its "energy" being absorbed into the succubus.

That already seems gruesome and harsh beyond merely "fitting".

hhhat09 wrote:
Hell is a punishment, what kinda punishment would "one time in the pool" be???

A very gruesome, brutal and terrifying one. I quite sincerely don't understand how anyone could think it's somehow "not enough".

I have to agree with Stabs and Shady here.

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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:06 am

Welcome to the Club - this makes four of us. lol!
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 10:23 am

I
French Snackie wrote:
'm fine with what's currently in the wiki. Souls are "reincarnated".

Ok wait just a minute there, what do you mean by that, can you elaborate on that, that's the biggest issue i find with this and why i made my point, are you saying they're already dead and then will actually die once they get eaten by and angel or succubus or something else, that the biggest point I'm trying to make is right there, and more specifically why and how, then to explain why they can't just do that again after being eaten by a succubus why is it all the sudden ok right then before this "reincarnation'. Where they get permanently absorbed. I'd be fine with the wiki if it could only explain in a bit better detail why that is.

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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 11:02 am

What FS means by "reincarnation" is that souls take on a physical form in Heaven and Hell, hence why demons and ceiciels there can interact with them there as if they were solid objects.  It was probably a bad word choice from FS's perspective.

The way it works is that someone dies on the mortal plane, its soul is then dragged to limbo or wherever they are judged by psychopomps, and then are sent directly to Heaven or Hell depending on how white or black its soul is. What happens next depends on how the proverbial bureaucracy in Hell or Heaven is feeling like doing that day.

In any case, could you show us what part in the wiki itself bugs you so that we can better address it, please?  Cause I feel like we're gonna be going in circles without a proper starting point.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 11:12 am

Shady Knight wrote:
The way it works is that someone dies on the mortal plane, its soul is then dragged to limbo or wherever they are judged by psychopomps, and then are sent directly to Heaven or Hell depending on how white or black its soul is.  What happens next depends on how the proverbial bureaucracy in Hell or Heaven is feeling like doing that day.

Heaven and Hell are not a singular entity so they can't be dragged there after judgment. Presuming that each one has a singular control entity is just Abrahamic mythos talking. Each separate ethereal plane or 'world' in Lydus corresponding to Heaven or Hell has it's own properties and preferences. The psychopomps from these various worlds of Heaven and Hell then are going to capture the souls they feel the most affinity to and take it back to their planes to further strengthen them.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 11:19 am

Whatever, that's not really the point. The point is that a mortal's soul doesn't normally linger on the mortal world after death unless some weird shenanigans happen, and since Karbo prefers deaths to be final, what with his entire setting more or less revolving around it, it's safe to say that a disembodied soul is not coming back to the mortal world, or at least not in Felarya.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 11:25 am

Yet i the tomes...it happens, more specifically a fairy, and by means through a book. Then you got Ghost so...Though wait unless they're out right eaten by an ethereal, which is a sure case of stating ones not going to come back. Thats the definitive way of saying someone is dead or rather "Goes back to non-existance" But all the meanwhile If the Succubus eats them on the mortal realm they'll just eat them again on the ethereal realm. I don't quite understand if it's that one way or not. But i'm sure someone could help me out with this.

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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 11:33 am

I don't think Karbo ever answered that. There are arguments on both sides, that the soul is digested along with the body simply because it's an angel or succubus, or that the soul isn't digested because the succubus or angel is technically currently in a form that can't interact with souls, and so is then dragged to the afterlife by a psychopomp. I don't think he ever answered if they can interact with souls in the mortal plane in the first place, either. I think it's implied that they can, since that seems to be one of the only ways to permanently kill an elemental is if the elemental spirit is eaten by a soul eater, but so far it's unsubstantiated.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Thu Apr 23, 2015 11:46 am

Shady Knight wrote:
I don't think Karbo ever answered that.  There are arguments on both sides, that the soul is digested along with the body simply because it's an angel or succubus, or that the soul isn't digested because the succubus or angel is technically currently in a form that can't interact with souls, and so is then dragged to the afterlife by a psychopomp.  I don't think he ever answered if they can interact with souls in the mortal plane in the first place, either.  I think it's implied that they can, since that seems to be one of the only ways to permanently kill an elemental is if the elemental spirit is eaten by a soul eater, but so far it's unsubstantiated.

It is answered:

The Wiki wrote:

However, things are not as clear cut on a physical world. For example, if a succubus eats a human in Felarya, after she digest the body of her prey, their soul will attempt to go either to Hell or Heaven. Since the succubus is neither in a completely physical nor spiritual state, it makes the retention of the soul somewhat difficult. With some training most succubi are able to eat and consume both the body and soul of their victims in one go, but young or unexperienced ones might not.

Ethereal beings can digest items from a physical plane provided they know how to properly interact with said planes. As I discussed in chat, this is basically the difference between an amateur and someone with experience as a pyschopomp.
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PostSubject: Re: What would happen after a soul gets digested by a succubus?   Sat Apr 25, 2015 10:10 am

I never was a big fan of the concept of souls, at least how common media portrays them. Seems weird that demons can control something so otherworldly. I don't know why, even though they are otherworldly themselves.

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