My idea for an earth elemental/golem

Okay, I had come up with a drawing of this elemental and i thought, how cool would it be if it wasn't like just an elemental but a construct someone had created for their own uses. i know the golem forum is here already but i'm a little late here for that topic ^^; anyhow my idea was this Crystal/Earth golem(or elemental whichever) that has an overall body shape of a naga. There are gap in between each large serrated crystal for it's body. It is a combination of earth and crystal and where these things are created there is magnetism in the minerals that is used to created it. And the magnets push against against each other and create these gaps like in levitation magnets. And geomancer magic holds it all together can then be used to their will. The creatures have scythe-like hands which are covered with extra serrated crystals. And the end of the tale is like a club which is also serrated. They can tunnel in the ground with ease, even though there appearence may suggest otherwise. Size changing is a special ability, but siphoning earth and energy from the ground they can grow to enormous sizes. The size in this golem varies, it can be up to 50ft, half that of a giant naga. Even against opponents larger than themselves they are deadly. Putting these things around water is ill advised, because it will only make the crystal on the golem grow larger. They can also shoot small spikes from their arms when not in striking distance. These golems are incredibly good fighters. It something any geomancer would love to have. But there is a limit, creating such a creature takes a lot of energy to do so, and will leave the user physically exhausted. It is advised to be used only by professional geomancers. In addition to that this golem has weaknesses:

1. Heat; I am not talking about a little fire, no it has to be at a temperature of at least 350 degrees farenheit and and the heat wave overall has to be able to hit most of the body, heat deonionizes the magnestism in the crystal which would cause it to collapse to the grap in a heap of earth.

2. Electricity; this has to be one of the most effective ways to take this golem zealot down. Electricity will disrupt the flow of the magnestism and the golem will go haywire. Then allowing it's opponent to strike.

Powers and abilities:

1. Size changing; but it is limited.

2.Energy Siphoning.

3. Grows in water.

I had a lot of fun creating this elemental. So please give me feedback and let me know whacha think

The first thing you need to know is that this sounds more like a sub-species of Earth Elemental or a sub-element of Earth Element. But that is assuming that it is an Elemental. If it is a golem, then it's a bit different. See, the key difference is that an Elemental is a mass of, usually, inanimate objects possessed by a spirit. This mass is then shaped into a body for the spirit, which includes a system of organs. So you could say that Elementals are close to living creatures.

Golems, on the other hand, are a mass of inanimate object that has been animated via a mage, or by ambient wild magic. Golems have no internal organ whatsoever, and are usually akin to lifeless automatons, rather than sapient creatures. The first step to this idea should be to decide whether it is a golem or an elemental.

The second thing would be that there are a lot of superfluous details. Both elementals and golems are heavily magical, since it is what animates them. In the case of the magnet thing or the earth connecting the crystals, it's rather pointless since it could just be levitating by magical powers.

Now to the third, and the biggest problem, the abilities. First of all, size-changing is strictly in the fairy's arsenal. Technically other species can do it, but their skill are vastly inferior to fairies. While inanimate objects seem to be affected easily no matter the caster's species, it's because it has no magical field. The moment you animate it, it will start generating a magic field. The only logical way for them to "grow" would be to take more of the same material composing its body and form a second layer over its body. I have no idea what the "growth in water" comes from. I'm assuming that some crystals do that, but I'm sure they are pretty rare. Energy syphoning, especially magic, I have no problem with, since a lot of crystal themed creatures seem to have it. But this raise a question if they are indeed golems: if the mage animated magic syphoning crystals, wouldn't it be more efficient to simply hold the inanimate crystal on him and use it to syphon another mage's energy in case of a fight?

Sean Okotami wrote:

I have no idea what the "growth in water" comes from. I'm assuming that some crystals do that, but I'm sure they are pretty rare.

Actually there's this really common type of crystal that grows from water. It's called "ice."
Haha, I made a joke!
Apart from that, I know of no others.

The first thing you must understand is that there is a major difference between golems and elementals.
Golems are constructs created by another being. Golems are given a magical "AI" making them like a robot. Depending on the complexity of this AI they may or may not be able to form their own thoughts. With a complex enough AI they may even be sapient. However Golems lack a soul and when they die their is no afterlife for them.

Elementals are spirits that inhabit a particular some form of non living mater and form actual organ systems in these and require food. Elementals have varying levels of voracity and power and varying levels of self awareness from that of an animal to that of a god (in this regard their spirit is similar to a golems AI). They also don't require the body they take up to survive able to leave it and form a new one, but they must form a body of the same element of material that their body was made from originally (i.e. a fire elemental cannot become a water elemental). The only way to kill an elemental is to damage its spirit as I said above they can just choose to make a new body if it becomes damaged, but this is difficult as very few creatures are capable of doing this. Elementals being magic in nature are also injured by anit-magic spells and oppositely aligned magic.

Another note is that a geomancer would bind an already existing elemental to them and not form them themselves as elementals have a spirit of their own and not an AI that can just be created.

When speaking of nagas it is important to realize that a nagas height varies and that it's length does not. Most nagas average height is around 130 feet if i am not mistaken but their length is either 3 or 4 times greater depending on the type of snake you base it off of. This makes your size confusing as that would be a range of 50-65 feet if you are speaking of height or 50 - 260 feet if you are speaking of length.

So before I provide further critique I would like to know whether this is
a) a golem
or
b) an elemental
and whether you are referring to height or length.

Sean I would like to point out that Elementals do have a large size range based on the power of their spirit they can animate more or their element around them. Also their are crystals that absorb water but for a crystal to actually grow in water the water would have to have the same substance dissolved in the water and as the water evaporates the substance will either begin to form crystals or if their is an existing crystal it will use that crystal seed to grow larger.

I do know that. What I was saying was "just grow bigger" is strictly a fairy ability. In reality, the elemental spirit just animates a massive chunk of land from the start, provided they are strong enough to do it. But if they want to grow bigger, they have to assimilate more of the same element to its body, which IMO is more akin to expansion.

Sean Okotami wrote:

I do know that. What I was saying was "just grow bigger" is strictly a fairy ability. In reality, the elemental spirit just animates a massive chunk of land from the start, provided they are strong enough to do it. But if they want to grow bigger, they have to assimilate more of the same element to its body, which IMO is more akin to expansion.

Point taken as without more earth around them they wouldn't be able to grow.

Also for crystals growing in water besides ice when the temperature drops below 0 degrees Celsius there are none that grow, however as I said above there are crystals that expand in water. Please see search hydrates such as Copper (II) Sulfate for further explanation on the subject.

buddha66667 wrote:

The first thing you must understand is that there is a major difference between golems and elementals.
Golems are constructs created by another being. Golems are given a magical "AI" making them like a robot. Depending on the complexity of this AI they may or may not be able to form their own thoughts. With a complex enough AI they may even be sapient. However Golems lack a soul and when they die their is no afterlife for them.

Elementals are spirits that inhabit a particular some form of non living mater and form actual organ systems in these and require food. Elementals have varying levels of voracity and power and varying levels of self awareness from that of an animal to that of a god (in this regard their spirit is similar to a golems AI). They also don't require the body they take up to survive able to leave it and form a new one, but they must form a body of the same element of material that their body was made from originally (i.e. a fire elemental cannot become a water elemental). The only way to kill an elemental is to damage its spirit as I said above they can just choose to make a new body if it becomes damaged, but this is difficult as very few creatures are capable of doing this. Elementals being magic in nature are also injured by anit-magic spells and oppositely aligned magic.

Another note is that a geomancer would bind an already existing elemental to them and not form them themselves as elementals have a spirit of their own and not an AI that can just be created.

When speaking of nagas it is important to realize that a nagas height varies and that it's length does not. Most nagas average height is around 130 feet if i am not mistaken but their length is either 3 or 4 times greater depending on the type of snake you base it off of. This makes your size confusing as that would be a range of 50-65 feet if you are speaking of height or 50 - 260 feet if you are speaking of length.

So before I provide further critique I would like to know whether this is
a) a golem
or
b) an elemental
and whether you are referring to height or length.

Sean I would like to point out that Elementals do have a large size range based on the power of their spirit they can animate more or their element around them. Also their are crystals that absorb water but for a crystal to actually grow in water the water would have to have the same substance dissolved in the water and as the water evaporates the substance will either begin to form crystals or if their is an existing crystal it will use that crystal seed to grow larger.

I know now, sorry, yeah um it is supposed to be a golem, i often find it hard to tell the difference. And for size: 9ft tall, 16ft long(this is minimal) The largest it can get is 54ft tall, and 67ft long. sorry, Proportions were not mentioned very well ^^;

Sean Okotami wrote:

The first thing you need to know is that this sounds more like a sub-species of Earth Elemental or a sub-element of Earth Element. But that is assuming that it is an Elemental. If it is a golem, then it's a bit different. See, the key difference is that an Elemental is a mass of, usually, inanimate objects possessed by a spirit. This mass is then shaped into a body for the spirit, which includes a system of organs. So you could say that Elementals are close to living creatures.

Golems, on the other hand, are a mass of inanimate object that has been animated via a mage, or by ambient wild magic. Golems have no internal organ whatsoever, and are usually akin to lifeless automatons, rather than sapient creatures. The first step to this idea should be to decide whether it is a golem or an elemental.

The second thing would be that there are a lot of superfluous details. Both elementals and golems are heavily magical, since it is what animates them. In the case of the magnet thing or the earth connecting the crystals, it's rather pointless since it could just be levitating by magical powers.

Now to the third, and the biggest problem, the abilities. First of all, size-changing is strictly in the fairy's arsenal. Technically other species can do it, but their skill are vastly inferior to fairies. While inanimate objects seem to be affected easily no matter the caster's species, it's because it has no magical field. The moment you animate it, it will start generating a magic field. The only logical way for them to "grow" would be to take more of the same material composing its body and form a second layer over its body. I have no idea what the "growth in water" comes from. I'm assuming that some crystals do that, but I'm sure they are pretty rare. Energy syphoning, especially magic, I have no problem with, since a lot of crystal themed creatures seem to have it. But this raise a question if they are indeed golems: if the mage animated magic syphoning crystals, wouldn't it be more efficient to simply hold the inanimate crystal on him and use it to syphon another mage's energy in case of a fight?

Okay got it thanks for pointing out the flaws with powers, i appreciate it. But as for crystals growing in water, there are some that do. they can expand in water . and it is a golem. Thanks for feedback

buddha66667 wrote:

Sean Okotami wrote:

I do know that. What I was saying was "just grow bigger" is strictly a fairy ability. In reality, the elemental spirit just animates a massive chunk of land from the start, provided they are strong enough to do it. But if they want to grow bigger, they have to assimilate more of the same element to its body, which IMO is more akin to expansion.

Point taken as without more earth around them they wouldn't be able to grow.

Also for crystals growing in water besides ice when the temperature drops below 0 degrees Celsius there are none that grow, however as I said above there are crystals that expand in water. Please see search hydrates such as Copper (II) Sulfate for further explanation on the subject.

It's true that the earth couldn't grow with it(if it is allowed to grow. apperently only fairies can do it. but i dont see it like a growing spell, more of a natural ability that comes with it's element.) The earth is like the covering over the crystal that came with it from the ground, it's more like all crystal with an earthy covering on some parts of it's body. I really appreciate the feedback and info guys

Primeval Hunter wrote:

anyhow my idea was this Crystal/Earth golem(or elemental whichever) that has an overall body shape of a naga. There are gap in between each large serrated crystal for it's body. It is a combination of earth and crystal and where these things are created there is magnetism in the minerals that is used to created it. And the magnets push against against each other and create these gaps like in levitation magnets.

Might I suggest you look up how magnets work.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

And geomancer magic holds it all together can then be used to their will.

Here is a link to golems I suggest that you look it over.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

The creatures have scythe-like hands which are covered with extra serrated crystals. And the end of the tale is like a club which is also serrated. They can tunnel in the ground with ease, even though there appearence may suggest otherwise. Size changing is a special ability, but siphoning earth and energy from the ground they can grow to enormous sizes.

Ok golems bodies are stuck the size they are made elementals can however change the size and shape of their body.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

The size in this golem varies, it can be up to 50ft, half that of a giant naga. Even against opponents larger than themselves they are deadly. Putting these things around water is ill advised, because it will only make the crystal on the golem grow larger.

How does this work crystals don't grow this way. At least none that I know of (keep in mind that I am very good in chemistry so provide examples). The only way that the crystals could grow would be if they were some type of hydrate such as copper (II) sulfate and that would only be because they would be taking in water and that would be limited.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

They can also shoot small spikes from their arms when not in striking distance. These golems are incredibly good fighters. It something any geomancer would love to have. But there is a limit, creating such a creature takes a lot of energy to do so, and will leave the user physically exhausted. It is advised to be used only by professional geomancers. In addition to that this golem has weaknesses:

1. Heat; I am not talking about a little fire, no it has to be at a temperature of at least 350 degrees farenheit and and the heat wave overall has to be able to hit most of the body, heat deonionizes the magnestism in the crystal which would cause it to collapse to the grap in a heap of earth.

Wait what? I am also good with physics yes magnetic materials are affected by extremes in temperature but at these temperatures the magnetic field would have to be produced by a weak magnet for it to have any noticeable affect on magnetism and then the magnets wouldn't be able to provide the type of levitation you are describing.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

2. Electricity; this has to be one of the most effective ways to take this golem zealot down. Electricity will disrupt the flow of the magnestism and the golem will go haywire. Then allowing it's opponent to strike.

Ok here is a quick lesson on magnetism moving charges (electricity) forms a magnetic field around the charge in circular rings. Each of these rings will from poles (North and South) when presented with another magnetic field. Only a magnetic field can interfere with a magnetic field and that is only while the field is present. After a strike with electricity the field would realign itself once the source other field was gone.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

I know now, sorry, yeah um it is supposed to be a golem, i often find it hard to tell the difference. And for size: 9ft tall, 16ft long(this is minimal) The largest it can get is 54ft tall, and 67ft long. sorry, Proportions were not mentioned very well ^^;

Why this particular height range? If it is a golem it is created and therefore the only limit on size is the amount of materials and magic to animate it.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

Okay got it thanks for pointing out the flaws with powers, i appreciate it. But as for crystals growing in water, there are some that do. they can expand in water . and it is a golem. Thanks for feedback

Again what crystals? Growing crystals and crystals expanding are two very different things.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

It's true that the earth couldn't grow with it(if it is allowed to grow. apperently only fairies can do it. but i dont see it like a growing spell, more of a natural ability that comes with it's element.) The earth is like the covering over the crystal that came with it from the ground, it's more like all crystal with an earthy covering on some parts of it's body. I really appreciate the feedback and info guys

Fairies grow by using dimentional scaling magic. This means that they don't think about growing or shrinking so much as I want to be bigger/smaller than that.Here is the link to fairy magic and how it works. You now are talking about its element golems don't have elements they are just made out of whatever and animated.

buddha66667 wrote:

Primeval Hunter wrote:

anyhow my idea was this Crystal/Earth golem(or elemental whichever) that has an overall body shape of a naga. There are gap in between each large serrated crystal for it's body. It is a combination of earth and crystal and where these things are created there is magnetism in the minerals that is used to created it. And the magnets push against against each other and create these gaps like in levitation magnets.

Might I suggest you look up how magnets work.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

And geomancer magic holds it all together can then be used to their will.

Here is a link to golems I suggest that you look it over.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

The creatures have scythe-like hands which are covered with extra serrated crystals. And the end of the tale is like a club which is also serrated. They can tunnel in the ground with ease, even though there appearence may suggest otherwise. Size changing is a special ability, but siphoning earth and energy from the ground they can grow to enormous sizes.

Ok golems bodies are stuck the size they are made elementals can however change the size and shape of their body.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

The size in this golem varies, it can be up to 50ft, half that of a giant naga. Even against opponents larger than themselves they are deadly. Putting these things around water is ill advised, because it will only make the crystal on the golem grow larger.

How does this work crystals don't grow this way. At least none that I know of (keep in mind that I am very good in chemistry so provide examples). The only way that the crystals could grow would be if they were some type of hydrate such as copper (II) sulfate and that would only be because they would be taking in water and that would be limited.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

They can also shoot small spikes from their arms when not in striking distance. These golems are incredibly good fighters. It something any geomancer would love to have. But there is a limit, creating such a creature takes a lot of energy to do so, and will leave the user physically exhausted. It is advised to be used only by professional geomancers. In addition to that this golem has weaknesses:

1. Heat; I am not talking about a little fire, no it has to be at a temperature of at least 350 degrees farenheit and and the heat wave overall has to be able to hit most of the body, heat deonionizes the magnestism in the crystal which would cause it to collapse to the grap in a heap of earth.

Wait what? I am also good with physics yes magnetic materials are affected by extremes in temperature but at these temperatures the magnetic field would have to be produced by a weak magnet for it to have any noticeable affect on magnetism and then the magnets wouldn't be able to provide the type of levitation you are describing.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

2. Electricity; this has to be one of the most effective ways to take this golem zealot down. Electricity will disrupt the flow of the magnestism and the golem will go haywire. Then allowing it's opponent to strike.

Ok here is a quick lesson on magnetism moving charges (electricity) forms a magnetic field around the charge in circular rings. Each of these rings will from poles (North and South) when presented with another magnetic field. Only a magnetic field can interfere with a magnetic field and that is only while the field is present. After a strike with electricity the field would realign itself once the source other field was gone.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

I know now, sorry, yeah um it is supposed to be a golem, i often find it hard to tell the difference. And for size: 9ft tall, 16ft long(this is minimal) The largest it can get is 54ft tall, and 67ft long. sorry, Proportions were not mentioned very well ^^;

Why this particular height range? If it is a golem it is created and therefore the only limit on size is the amount of materials and magic to animate it.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

Okay got it thanks for pointing out the flaws with powers, i appreciate it. But as for crystals growing in water, there are some that do. they can expand in water . and it is a golem. Thanks for feedback

Again what crystals? Growing crystals and crystals expanding are two very different things.

Primeval Hunter wrote:

It's true that the earth couldn't grow with it(if it is allowed to grow. apperently only fairies can do it. but i dont see it like a growing spell, more of a natural ability that comes with it's element.) The earth is like the covering over the crystal that came with it from the ground, it's more like all crystal with an earthy covering on some parts of it's body. I really appreciate the feedback and info guys

Fairies grow by using dimentional scaling magic. This means that they don't think about growing or shrinking so much as I want to be bigger/smaller than that.Here is the link to fairy magic and how it works. You now are talking about its element golems don't have elements they are just made out of whatever and animated.

I must admit, a lot of my description is way off. I really didn't do my homework. Since my design is only an idea let me rephrase my description, because where i am right now is like

Indeed. It seems that you didn't do your homework.
That is an error, one that quite a few people make. Rushing into something unprepared is never a good idea and leads nowhere. I strongly suggest you go over the Felarya wiki and talk to existing members.

Also, please don't quote the post above you if you are only responding to one or who points. It just wastes page space and looks ugly, especially when there are long quotes within quotes

I'm new to the forms, but they way they can assimilate matter into their own bodies is something that seems could be similar, but less powerful fairy growth spell. I have been tinkering with a similar idea though.

But for crystals that grow in water...are they absorbing the water like a sponge, or using it as an energy source to increase in mass? This could be be a factor in durability of the crystal, as the strength of a solid chunk of crystal is much more then a crystal with water uniformly packed in the crystal like pockets.

ac2 wrote:

I'm new to the forms, but they way they can assimilate matter into their own bodies is something that seems could be similar, but less powerful fairy growth spell. I have been tinkering with a similar idea though.

But for crystals that grow in water...are they absorbing the water like a sponge, or using it as an energy source to increase in mass? This could be be a factor in durability of the crystal, as the strength of a solid chunk of crystal is much more then a crystal with water uniformly packed in the crystal like pockets.

Four year necropost. Ouch. On my old forum this would get a lecutre. Fortunately these guys are more mellow and you do bring up an interesting point. Alas the person who started this article has likely forgotten it after four years. =/

jedi-explorer wrote:

ac2 wrote:

I'm new to the forms, but they way they can assimilate matter into their own bodies is something that seems could be similar, but less powerful fairy growth spell. I have been tinkering with a similar idea though.

But for crystals that grow in water...are they absorbing the water like a sponge, or using it as an energy source to increase in mass? This could be be a factor in durability of the crystal, as the strength of a solid chunk of crystal is much more then a crystal with water uniformly packed in the crystal like pockets.

Four year necropost. Ouch. On my old forum this would get a lecutre. Fortunately these guys are more mellow and you do bring up an interesting point. Alas the person who started this article has likely forgotten it after four years. =/

Double post, and sorry, new to the forms. Wont happen again!

Alas, indeed, it's a bit late to revive this thread. I'm locking it; if you have fresh ideas, don't hesitate to start a new one.