More detailed information about Naga biology and life cycles

On my story that is in the stories forum, I made the personal life of a male naga the focul point. I wanted explain why males were not numerous compared to the females, and I also wanted to give a bit of an idea on what the males might be like at a personal level.

The below is sort of a basic lifestye of a male naga that I came up with, since I didn't really see anything in the wiki.

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Yeah typically females of snakes and such are bigger, but a large part of that is because male snakes/spiders are shortlived. For example often times male spiders are eaten after mating. Here is what I'm sort of suggesting as the Naga male lifecycle.

1. Naga Males and Females are about equal in numbers when born.
2. Naga Males and females are about in equal numbers when they reach there growth spurt.
3. Naga Males at young adult hood, are completely outclassed by the bigger males, and are forced into the more dangerous parts of the world, where they have to survive mostly on their own.
4. By the time the Naga Males have grown large enough to challenge some of the established males, about 2/3 of them are dead from other large predators/starvation.
5. These newly matured males then must challenge the established males for territorial rights(some die doing this), and acquire trophies from other large predators in order to impress the females on their strength and prowess(Raynor mostly dodged this once he figured out about humans, but he still experienced the exile to the more dangerous areas, he simply found a safer way to win the female favor).
6. The surviving males which pass these challenges are then able to breed, which by this point only about 5-10% of the originals are still alive.
7. In general the males grow faster and larger than the females, but typically never live to reach the extreme sizes raynor has(or that really ancient females reach), since eventually they are going to be killed in battle.
8. Males establish territories, within which multiple females might live. The females tend to come and go however, so the females that might live nearest might not be the ones he breeds with. The job of the males is to ensure the safety of the territory from rivals and other predators. From all of the years of "big game" hunting they do, they spend much of there tme when not pursuing the ladies, hunting many of the giant predators that wander in(spidergirls, harpies etc.).
9. The bigger the mature male, and more skilled in combat he is, typically the fewer of these big predators will want to enter his domain. This in turn makes the region much more attractive to females, especially those in heat.
10. The few males who live a long time like raynor(<1%), grow to colossol sizes. They tend to have huge territories(raynors is technically massive since not only is he defending it, but so is an army of humans) Hence why in so much of the world male Naga are so rare. A young male would be torn in half by one of these guys if he tried to do anything but pass through.
11. The final situation is that the vast majority of the good territories(prime places where most of the Naga like to live) have only a few old(500+ years) running them. The decent territories have the mature males (300+ years), and the dangerous places the young. The prime realestate is where most of the females live, but the decent territory is in the less populated "routes" between Naga friendly zones(area that aren't controlled by fairy and such). The young males have to eke by on the outskirts of spider territory, or even in spider territory or other hostile zones. As the males mature because by 500 years age growth slows down considerably, the males that reach the late 400s begin to challenge the established males for dominance in the prime territories. This is typically done once a year right before the females come into heat. These battles can be epic in scale, as sometimes 2 lesser males might form an alliance to oust an established male for breeding rights in the highly female populated areas(often these pairs are twin brothers who both came from the same mother).

Now with all of that said, the females often have a preferred male they like, so they often don't even mate with the male who controls the region she might live in, but head over to the next territory to visit friends, and give the resident male a booty call. The females also are not "ruled" by the males by the males in any means. The land is "ruled" by the males but nothing more. If the male is an asshole, he might find that the resident females either turn on him and drive him out(or in rare cases kill him), or that they'll turn away any females who might want to mate with him(deny him the nooky usually gets positive results)

My basic reasons for the life cycle above:


The basis that I'm kind of giving the male Naga is sort of analagous to the behavior of male lions, albiet with quite a few differences. I also try to explain some of the physical differences between the male and females. For example, I make the conjecture that males grow faster than females, but tend to die young, thus most males are not that large, but the old males are massive(once again similar to lions or gorillas). I also make the guess that like snakes, naga never stop growing, they merely grow very slowly upon reaching adult hood, and that often times the age of a Naga is indicated by its size(and hence the "respect" other naga would show as befitting an elder). A female that is very large by my guess would be on that is exceptionally old(although naga don't really age like humans do), although a male might reach that great size at a younger age(although very few males live the 500 years I suggest is the minimum to reach "colossal" status).

I also make the guess that males take up hunting other predators as a means of proving their "manliness" as well as making there territories safer for any offspring that they might sire. Thus when a male has a multitudes of Harpy Wings and Spider legs in his lair, when a female sees this she knows that this male is capable of making the region where he lives safer from predators while she might be raising a Nagaling. I also suggest that because the males are "exiled" when they are young(similar to how male lions have to survive solo before challenging a reigning male for a pride), they are forced to live in more dangerous regions of the world that are much more hostile to Naga. This harsh upbringing kills off most of the weak and foolish males, thus the ones that do become large enough to challenge the existing males are not only excellent fighters, but they tend to be intelligent(this acts as a means of ensuring that only the "best and brightest" sire the next generation of Naga).

However, the males are not "rulers" of kingdoms as I mentioned above. They merely are wardens of a territory, that they try to make as appealing to the resident females as possible and as foreboding to other males(once again it's all about breeding). The females are really the ones who rule the roost. While a massive mature male individual might be 2 or 3 times stronger than a female and likely a better fighter(it's all they do), the females outnumber him at least 10 to 1, and of course they can choose who to mate with. If the resident male ever hurts a female or worse kills one, word will spread of what he's done, and if a bunch of males immediately don't kill him trying to overthrow him from his territory(as they would see him as a coward and thus weak), then the females will either kill him, or drive him out and put him on the dreaded nookie blacklist(which means that NO female naga will ever mate with him for the rest of his sorry life).

On Magic and Tribes

The other thing I took liberties with in the creation of Raynor, was that he was a Naga of the Stonetail tribe(which I made the assumption to mean that his tribe was a group of Naga that lived in a certain neck of the woods, and were attuned to the earth element). I also attributed the earth elemental focus, as being a bit more mundane in that it didn't actually give him much in the ways of powers(like freezing things or what not), but that the earth magic was passive. By passive I mean that he doesn't really have much in the way of control over the earth, but that his body is constantly drawing strength from the earth. This means that he is more resiliant(harder to kill or hurt), bigger, and that he's stronger then other naga of equal size. However he doesn't have much in the ways of abilites that he can actively use. About the full extent of what he can do actively is shape the immediate earth near him(and by that i mean he can make indentations or rises in the ground or slowly shape rocks, not summon spikes or launch boulders). However, I am planning on seeing if external artifice can allow him to channel the power he draws from the earth(in the form of a huge warhammer that the Humans construct for him that allows him to focus his strength into concentrated areas). Basically I envision the power of the earth as being very great, but by its nature mostly uncontrollable, and those who can tap into its full potential don't really have any control over what happens(as in a focused attack from his warhammer might cause a powerful shockwave to permeate through the earth destroying everything nearby but that he can't direct the shockwave). He is also a bit slower movement wise then other naga. I kind of want his abilities to reflect on how I visualize earth magic to be. Immensely powerful, gradual, uncontrollable, and at times violent. I also wanted to portray many Naga of this variety as more tradtional, proud, patient, and down to earth. They are a bit more serious than many Naga, but value honesty and hold their honor above all else. Possibly the only variety of Naga that if it says it won't eat you, won't eat you(however it doesn't mean it won't feed you to its friend lol). However Naga are sentient beings, and some earth oriented Naga might be upbeat and bublby.

I also created another female Naga who was attuned to air. I envisioned her, as being lithe, and extremely fast and agile. While she might not be as strong as the Earth attuned naga, she's far faster than they are, and might even be capable of limited flight(which could more accurately be considered large jumps) by using the air to lift her lighter form up(she doesn't have wings, but can summon strong updrafts that can carry her short distances). She also can summon vortices to disorient prey or predators, as well as immobilize them. Personality wise, I wanted her to be intesely curious, quick witted, sarcastic, incorrigible, impatient and wily. I envision the air Naga as being similar in that respect. Perhaps not the strongest, but fearsome in there own way, but most dangerous in the fact that they tend to be freethinkers, and visionaries.

As far as the tribes go, I envision them as the Naga of a given home range. That's not to say that there aren't other Naga there, it just means that they are the most common variety in that place. For example water Naga tend to live near rivers and lakes, while the ice Naga might be more common in the colder regions. By tribes, don't get the assumption that Naga are "organized", but I kind of envision a limited hierarchy largely based on seniority. With the most ancient of the female Naga(who might be 10,000+ years old), called "Queens". These queens function as sort of the grandmothers to all of the Naga of her tribe, and try to ensure that the tribe stays healthy and safe. They alone hold the authority to organize the Naga of a region into meeting a direct threat(say an invasion of the land by Harpies in large numbers). I think it's possible for there to be Naga Kings that could theoretically be the most powerful of the Naga, but the chances of a male ever living long enough to achieve a size comparable to the ancient queens is HIGHLY unlikely(raynor is one of the oldest males known, at 800 years) so for a male to get to a somewhat similar size he'd have to be at least 5,000 years old.

On relations with prey and other predators

In my story Raynor has allied himself with the humans, for reasons that he sees beneficial to himself(in his case, siring a lot of offspring to rebuild his decimated tribe, and because the humans are his insurance policy against aggresive males incase they try to invade his territory). Raynor acts like a protector to the humans and Naga in his region, and in turn benefits by getting free food, shelter, beer, and entertainment from the humans, and loving from the ladies. Raynor experienced first hand that when multiple males are trying to take his territory, there is simply no way he can continuously fend them off(which occured do to his inadvertant stealing of the females from his rivals) thus he was driven off. Therefore by forming an alliance with the humans, he figured that could much more easily fend off other males, while still being protected if he's injured after a fight(which is when the weaker males often make there move to steal a territory). The relationship is possible because the humans developed an ointment that they coat themselves with, that gets into their skin making the humans inedible(taste so bad that the resident Naga quit eating them). Raynor having experienced the constant battle of being a male, figured that he'd rather enter a pact with these humans, and mutually protect each other. Raynor helps deal with dangeous predators in the region, and the humans in turn help him by providing him with untainted humans(in the forms of condemned criminals who've had the ointment counteracted) in order to help him butter up the ladies who crave good old fashioned human(and hence allow him to achieve his goal of siring a new generation of stonetails). Of course he gets a bit more creative than this, but that's in the story .

I believe that the similar actions could happen in other situations. Often because at times the interests of two different groups might coinside. This opens up the possiblity of many cool story angles(such as Cypress the Dryad).

Final Thoughts

Hopefully if anyone is still awake by this point, they will kind of understand why I think it might be useful to more thouroughly define the Naga lifecycle, as well as some ideas on differences. Of course the final word goes to Karbo who created this playground for me . So any feedback would be great.

I'm not agree with you about some points because you show more the naga as beast than sentient being.
The tribe are similar to society as humans eacho society can developp their own way of life, like our world with democracy,dictatorship and monarchy.

Do you really think the humans wil just survive by the fact they are inedible

No if you wake up a morning and you can not eat your favorite meal you won't search why and you don't search some solutions.

There is many solutions to solve a problems, Raynor choose a solution that suits him but another naga males or females can find another ways different than him.

You explain the rank of naga male by their age, but it's not enough even if you are big and powerfull you are not the strongest but the problem the king can be dethroned if he is not carefull. So the oldest naga can be defeated by a younger ones.

You developp many interesting point but you don't show both the advantages and drawbacks. There is one thing human can not control is the consequences of their action, when you thing a solution is stable there is always some flaws.

We still behave much in the same way according to our beastial instincts. We instinctively behave in certain ways in order to attract the opposite sex, and I can't see Naga being any different. Also from the way alot of other fiction about Nagas has been written up, there doesn't seem to be any tight organization amongst the Naga. That's why I suggested they were mostly affiliated by where they live, and hence the most senior and largest naga, are probably the only somewhat "authority" that the Naga actually live under. Otherwise they seem to be pretty independent to me.

As for humans survivng by making themselves inedible. It sure helps. They might not be currently eaten by the Naga in the area, but they are constantly being abducted by the other predators. It just happens to be that the humans had managed to figure out a way to deal the Naga. Technology wise the humans are late 19th century/early 20th. So they have cannons, and the like and have been in Felarya for over 50 years since their city was transported here. They are simply adopting a strategy that is common to many prey organisms, and that is to make themselves a less appealing target. They are heavily armed enough, and have dealt with predators for long enough, that as whole they are relatively safe. Raynor lives in a frontier city, so they have a lot more issues with predators. The Naga just don't happen to be one that is a major problem(mostly a nuisance stealing livestock), but they have serious problems with spider-women and harpies, and because these humans lack the technology for flight, and don't know where any of the harpy nests are, they've been having a rough time.

Lets look at the issue of strength of the males. If I compare them to creatures like lions, they are weaker than mature males when they first reach adult hood, and gradually become strong enough to challenge the mature males. It's sort of like putting a 16 old boy against a 30 year old man. The 30 year old man, if he's in good shape will 19/20 times trash the youngster. I can't see Naga being different, especially given that they don't appear to die of old age. I just made the conjecture that since snakes never stop growing, that perhaps naga are similar, and those that reach extreme age become immensely large and powerful.

Think of it like this. If I have an Ice naga that has Ice breath, the limiter of how powerful it's ice breath is purely the size of the Naga's lungs. The bigger the naga, the more powerful the ice breath. I figure the magical ability of a naga increases as they grow in size, and master the techniques with age.

The consequence of the humans becoming inedible to the Naga, is the gradual migration of the Naga from the region. This in turn has allowed for large numbers of Harpy to move in, which are much harder for these humans to deal with than the Naga(The humans don't know how to fly). The Naga were a thorn in the side of the humans, but they were tolerable and could be hunted and killed. Without the ability to fly and pursue the Harpies, the humans are largely helpless against them. So really all they traded was a bad predator for a worse one. The only upside for the humans is that because raynor is in the area, and can talk to other Naga, he can learn where the Harpy nest, and in turn cull them to an extent that is tolerable for the people region.

So yeah, the humans felt the burn from unintended consequences, but they aren't prepared to let the Naga go on a human munch fest, if it means the harpy are still going to be around.

Mhh there is some very interesting thoughts here

I'll be frank and say I was - and still am - a bit cautious toward the way you developp your theories..

While nothing is engraved in iron, Felarya as a whole is not supposed to change much from what it is now - for example, humans won't become a dominant race there - and I feel too much realism is pointless somehow when you deal with a fantasy world in the first place.

But you clearly have great ideas and imagination to go with it and your logical way of thinking is interesting ^^ I bet you could have long and detailled discussions there with Siafu789 or Cypress XD

Just a detail by the way : harpies and nagas don't go very bad along actually

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Lets look at the issue of strength of the males. If I compare them to creatures like lions, they are weaker than mature males when they first reach adult hood, and gradually become strong enough to challenge the mature males. It's sort of like putting a 16 old boy against a 30 year old man. The 30 year old man, if he's in good shape will 19/20 times trash the youngster. I can't see Naga being different, especially given that they don't appear to die of old age. I just made the conjecture that since snakes never stop growing, that perhaps naga are similar, and those that reach extreme age become immensely large and powerful.

Yes and no, it's truth a 30 year old man is stronger than 16 years old boy, in theory yes but the kid can find a gun and shoot on the 30 years old man. It's a question of rules and category, if the kid play the same game of the adults he loses it's true.

But as you say if you try to change the rules in your advantages you win. If the young boy know how to trick the adults he wins. There aren't one but many solution to solve a problem, in the rules you suggest Raynor is powerfull but if everyone follow the rules.

The strongest is the biggest or the most powerfull it's the one who know turn a situation to its advantage and defend its position

As in many competition, the champion was a challenger before.

The law of nature are a double edge sword in clear, you die as you live

The situation of Raynor is not so stable as you think because if there is a sudden change in the human condittion he is directly affected. In clear this guy will need to defend his interest against the other predators and the humans of the city too.

Nothing is engraved in Iron

You can win something today and lose it tomorrow if you don't defend it too. Because the rules you follow apply to you too

Our technology is the thing we create to survive but this same technology can kill us too

It's not that Raynor has a particular hatred to harpies, it's that they are not acting in HIS interests(which require that the humans be happy). He's taking a big gamble by working with the humans, since there are enough of them that they could turn on him, and he'd be so hopelessly outnumberd that his hide would become about a 2,000 pairs of boots. However, the potential payoff of using the humans to help protect a territory from other males is SO great, that if he pulls this off he will easily in the long haul be able to restore his tribe by siring ALOT of nagalings because the humans can help him fend off the rivals(since what are the chances of a potential rival being as friendly as Raynor to humans?). The humans here aren't a dominant race, there just a stable race, who've carved out a good chunk of the world, that they are managing to hold against the onslaught of predators and other human nations. The humans see Raynor as a necessary evil, albiet a pleasant one. Raynor costs them alot in food and material, as well as the unsightly aspect of giving away people to be eaten. But they also see Raynor as possibly a way to help protect the outlying human communities from the Harpy and Spiders that are beginning to move in. So the humans aren't exactly in happy fun land.

Raynor's lived his whole life by using his brains first, before resorting to his brawn, and it's brought him the good and bad. On the good, he's reached an age very few males accomplish(which mean's he's bigger and stronger than the vast majority of his rivals), and he's had a lot of success over the past few hundred years in breeding with females(but with Naga so rarely being in heat, he likely has only sired a few Nagalings). The bad is that he's made enemies of ALOT of the other males, in his former range. These aren't young bucks, but the big boys(they didn't like Raynor stealing the ladies away) and they don't very much like the ladies turning them down to some sissy who doesn't wander around slaughtering every big predator in sight(rather Raynor spent his time gathering humans, and playing off the female love for them). While he might be one of the best fighters out there, 1 man can only fight off so many people, and knowing that his tribe was far from having enough descendents to revive itself, he's hellbent on bringing them back(Plus he's more of a lover than a fighter).

A twisted scenario, that is goofy, amusing, and comical for all sides involved. The female Naga are upset because there are no humans, and Raynor is trying to change that by using chocolate as his secret weapon to make the few humans that are available so much better tasting that the females are willing to hang around. The human's aren't happy becuase the Naga moved out since the humans made themselves taste yucky, and now Harpies are moving in, and the humans can't handle them. Raynor is just caught in the middle of this mess, trying to keep himself on the good side of the humans he's working for, making love to the local women, ressurecting his people, all while trying to fend off the males who will ineviteably come after his land once they notice increasing numbers of females congregating where the chocolate covered humans are.

Any kind of change can be disastrous

Even the little change can have dramatical consequence but the problem you seem to not show it.

I explain the things who are rare become a generality, so with the time the naga will grow bigger and Raynor will become a normal naga.

As the nuclear weapons, everyone can have this weapon, you see the consequence.

You can stop a river to flow and the wind to breathe, the fire to burn.

The fact humans are not the dominant race is natural, all they can do it's to defend themselves.

We developp technology, yeah cool but if our technology show its limit because if the conditions our thecnology need is missing it doesn't work.

In Felarya you don't meet the same condition on Earth, the world is more unstable than you think

The human find a way to survive but it's not eternal, when the naga will find the loophole they will need to find a new way.

We call that the renewal, if the 30 years man in his generation was the strongest but if the generation of the 16 years old boy become more stronger than the 30 years old man. The man lose, in clear the youth take the place of the new

Sure, I was only reacting to this particular line concerning harpies ^^

<<<Thus when a male has a multitudes of Harpy Wings and Spider legs in his lair, when a female sees this she knows that this male is capable of making the region where he lives safer from predators

To Karbo: I seem to be making a name (or two names) for myself in the Felarya community. I mean, I've produced virtually nothing and yet already one of my characters exists as a rumor on the wiki.

I try to be logical (to a certain extent) in that I try to not let my imagination run wild-well, keep it disciplined. I think an undisciplined imagination is one major cause of Mary Sues/Gary Stus, for example. Which is also why few of my characters are sorcerers or warriors-I think those are cliche. I mean, a hero doesn't need to be armed to be one.

Siafu789 wrote:

To Karbo: I seem to be making a name (or two names) for myself in the Felarya community. I mean, I've produced virtually nothing and yet already one of my characters exists as a rumor on the wiki.

I try to be logical (to a certain extent) in that I try to not let my imagination run wild-well, keep it disciplined. I think an undisciplined imagination is one major cause of Mary Sues/Gary Stus, for example. Which is also why few of my characters are sorcerers or warriors-I think those are cliche. I mean, a hero doesn't need to be armed to be one.

I'm in the same case too:D

But the fact you take time to think about your story and the discussion on the forum will help to developp your idea

gwadahunter2222 wrote:

I'm in the same case too:D

But the fact you take time to think about your story and the discussion on the forum will help to developp your idea

Thanks, that means a lot. If you'd like to talk about each of our work, send a PM to me. I'll get back to you in the morning: as of now, it's very late on the East Coast of the United States.

Interestingly, a lot of the essay here is pretty true to what I envisioned for naga society as well, females hunt while males fight. It works pretty well in the wild, but the more contact a tribe has contact with human culture, the more they may adopt weapons and armor (on the males, females need as much stealth as they can get. Therefore, nudity. ) Also they would be picking up the human concept of honor and the lack thereof. Any smart clan would start forming rules for honorable combat, and combat might get more and more deadly as weaponry progresses.

Of course, honor would be a bit skewed to combat that favors whatever physical attribute the females prefer.

Cheating or dishonorable combat (like assassination) would be a quick way to a nookie blacklist at the very least.

I come back about the point about the size.

As it says "Size doesn't matter", I explain the growth cycle can vary from a character to another. I explain you can meet a kid taller than you, due to the fact they are partly humans. There can have many different between the specie of a same race, many factors can influence like the surrounding, the quality of the food and the education.

Raynor live longer and grow big because his cycle was slow but another naga with a fast cycle can reach the same size in less time.