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dragon808tr
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PostSubject: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:00 am

Hey everyone!

So I was thinking that i kinda feel that Felarya is kinda unsure of what common weapons are. On one hand, its about 17th century with swords, knives and such, with early guns such as Blunderbusses and Flintlock pistols coming into use (One shot guns with a lengthy reload time).

On another hand, it seems futuristic with laser weapons. (and the fact Negav's upper sections are depicted as futuristic looking). So would it be like Star trooper lazer guns which require a few hits to be lethal, or like Star Trek phasers (Or dalek lasers) which are pretty much lethal upon hitting targets. (i think it would be the first one, as the second one would be OP, however, the second one dealt with human sized enemies from both series).

Now obviously, magic can be made offensive, however, not everyone is a mage and would need some weapons. Guns most likely would be a go to weapon, medium to long range and can do decent damage, but likely more expensive than swords/knives, which would need to be at a close range to the pred and might do a little more damage.

So I have 2 questions essentially...

1. What age of weapons would be used/most common in Felarya? 17th century or Future weapons? (Ignoring magic attacks, as they are magic and not really weapons)

2. Would guns/long range weapons be better or worse against a pred than melee weapons such as swords and knives?
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Thu Jun 04, 2015 10:56 am

In Negav, swords and bows and the like are the most common because that's just the culture of the place, and also because I think Karbo said the Magiocrats are skeptical of advanced weaponry.  There are firearms and probably firearm stores, but they're pretty darn expensive and not very common.  At most I go with 19th century old west firearms, because let's be honest, unless you have a whole bunch of guys all lined up and shooting in the same general direction, early firearms are utter shit.  You'd be better off using a crossbow than a musket.  As far as modern and advanced firearms are concerned, then it gets tricky.  If someone has something like an assault rifle, it usual means he either, A) had it with him when he came to Felarya, B) is part of the Isolon Fist, C) is a Vishmital, or D) did some digging around the black market.  The Vishmitals aren't exactly a chummy bunch unless you're one of them, and it only makes sense for the military to make those weapons illegal unless you're also one of them.

As for other locations, you're better off asking the respective authors, but the general rule is that most other places will usually have lower tech weapon than Negav because of more limited resources.

Also... http://felarya.com/wiki/index.php?title=Weapons  Read the wiki.  If you have a question, chances are the wiki already has the answer for you.  I could say the same to almost every thread you made.

As for choosing between guns or swords to fight preds, really, use your brain for half a second. What would you rather take to fight Godzilla? Something that forces you to get close and put you at risk of getting stomped, or something that allows you to put some distance between you two? Neither of them is going to do anything, but really, it doesn't take a genius to know that range is your friend. In fact, it takes even less than a genius to realize that if you're ever in a situation where you must fight a pred, the correct solution is to run the fuck away.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Thu Jun 04, 2015 3:24 pm

Shady Knight wrote:
 Read the wiki.  If you have a question, chances are the wiki already has the answer for you.  I could say the same to almost every thread you made.


Seriously? I have read the wiki multiple times over, however, both my own findings and others have said it is inconsistent and needs upgrading. I kinda find that a little offensive. I read that before making the thread.

For example, their are 17th century stuff like midevil weapons, but also that air bomb (AIDs) and lasers. So it confused me on if it was more midevil or sci fi.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Thu Jun 04, 2015 4:30 pm

The thing with Jet Bikes is that it's pretty much used almost exclusively by the military. Supposedly, there are guilds that allow some people to use them, but I go with the general consensus that they're bloody expensive and so only the rich folks can have any realistic chance of affording their services. The thing you have to bear in mind is that Felarya, as a setting, is a patchwork. Many, many, MANY concepts were essentially made up as things go along, many of whom clash with old ideas, and it's obvious the setting needs some overhaul or some form of consolidation to remove most of the ambiguity about how Negav operates, its tech level, and all that jazz. The AID is the result of such thing. The weapon itself and the jetbikes for that matter aren't bad ideas, but they were conceptualized by other people and put in the wiki years before Karbo came forward and said that Negav is more or less in a pre-industrial stage as far as the common tech level is concerned. This is why you'll often run into things that seemingly contradicts themselves.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Thu Jun 04, 2015 5:39 pm

dragon808tr wrote:
Hey everyone!
or like Star Trek phasers (Or dalek lasers) which are pretty much lethal upon hitting targets.

Dalek "Death Rays" actually can be modded so as not to kill but to stun. Check out some Doctor Who guides for that.



Buuuut I digress massivly cause I let my passion get the better of me. Let's answer you previous questions:
Dragon Ate Her wrote:
1. What age of weapons would be used/most common in Felarya? 17th century or Future weapons? (Ignoring magic attacks, as they are magic and not really weapons)

2. Would guns/long range weapons be better or worse against a pred than melee weapons such as swords and knives?

1: Various kinds of weapons are present on Felarya, depending on location and the character wielding them.In fact character's weapons tend to be almost another character themselves sometimes. It depends. Weapons in Felarya are usually useless as they only weigh you down half the time in the jungle however sometimes a Fist Battlemage has a weapon imbued with magic or you have somebody like my Tamlin Landcaster who uses her rocketlaucher creatively and tactically to support allies or you have characters like Prave who can make a log a deadly weapon! It depends on how powerful/important you want yoru weapon to be and to figure out HOW POWERFUL it should be? Figure out how versatile it is, but treat it like a character! Don't just make some mary sue type sword that can cut through anything and send out shockwaves even if your character had to go to hell to get it. Seriously weilded a sword like that it wasn't much fun till I limited it's power and durability so it was powerful, but not Excalibur class powerful. For example it could cut through anything but a good solid blow from something heavier and non-enchanted could bend or break it.

2: Guns are awesome but if you've watched Jurassic Park? You might have noticed not overly effective on anything to big. Sooo make 'em bigger and fire badder ammo? Ah no. You'll be "mary suing" your weapons again and also think about encumberance and the fact 90% of the time in Felarya survivial comes to speed and mental clarity. Sometimes luck but those two are the best stats really. When I first made Tam's launcher it wasn't practical due to it's size so I shaved off some inches and made it more compact and for a while made it make it's own ammo but that got to be far too convenient so I tried smaller rounds. This made for a descent compromise but less explossive force which is another thing you have to take into account with firearms: they're LOUD and in Felarya stealth is key to survival if you can't call down a thunderstorm to blast your opponent to dust. This is why many characters in Felarya prefer bow and arrows to firearms. Not saying they are better, just quieter and lighter. Me I like the most silent projectile weapon of all: the blowgun. Hmm in fact a giant blow gun could....Hey I need to go write that down! Thanks, Damsel Eating Dragon! Oh and I hope this helped without lecturing too much XD

As for weapons ACROSS Fealarya? Variable. Felarya connects to millions of billions of possible places, even if dimensional shifts are not more "seasonal" than a every day thing, you still have various types of endless tech of all ages and level appearing in Felarya. I've always liked it for that point. But if you mean what locales have the most advanced tech? Well Negav has a mixture that's fairly more geared towards primative and magi-tech, but I believe it's not impossible to find high tech stuff there. Mostly with the Vishies and Delurans but as far as getting them to sell it? Probably not. You're best bet would be the Bazaar since loads of treasure hunters can't tell the diference betwen a Dilithium Crystal and Mazhir nor do they care! It's pretty and shiny so it's treasure but somebody with a eye for tech might realize that a raidio or a hyper induction matrix is more than just some piece of scrap metal. There's another source: salvage shops and such. Now if we skip over to Safe Harbor? Your chances of finding advanced tech of any kind? Pretty low especially on the high tech end since even scrap will probably be put to communal use, IE melted down to make metal for barrel rims, roofs or even metal untinsils and tools. Let's go to Chiotia all the way on the other coast. The chances of finding high tech goes down but at the same time uniquely you may find some things liek boat motors or salvaged bits of satalites that have crashed in the oceans easier...if a bit more water logged.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Thu Jun 04, 2015 5:41 pm

Well that does explain why the humans Karbo draws all have some form of bow and arrows, swords, or spears or knives. (and mages with staffs, but thats magic and not weapons).

I understand Karbo came up with it, but I take the Wiki as "Canon" Felarya, and other people have contributed ideas that Karbo has deemed to be cannon.

So what your saying, in a nutshell, is that its about the same as 17th century Euroupe in terms of weapons, as i described above with some early guns (Blunderbuss and Flintlock pistols, like what pirates use) but mostly swords, spears, and arrows are the most common used weapons?
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Thu Jun 04, 2015 7:30 pm

dragon808tr wrote:
Well that does explain why the humans Karbo draws all have some form of bow and arrows, swords, or spears or knives. (and mages with staffs, but thats magic and not weapons).

I understand Karbo came up with it, but I take the Wiki as "Canon" Felarya, and other people have contributed ideas that Karbo has deemed to be cannon.

So what your saying, in a nutshell, is that its about the same as 17th century Euroupe in terms of weapons, as i described above with some early guns (Blunderbuss and Flintlock pistols, like what pirates use) but mostly swords, spears, and arrows are the most common used weapons?

Karbo has drawn tech riffles and stuff too, but mostly in the manga than his common art. It's true he's more a fan of the fantasy-like side of Felarya artistically though. After all it's easy enough to do.

XD Well it's you right to. I just make up my own fanon when the setting is too lacking in what I'd like to see. Felarya'd Wiki takes too long to update and sometimes things, like Torin the Fucking Sharks and other fun stuff, just disappears when people withdraw there ideas. =/ "Canon" is fun but it limits your RPs and stories.

I'm saying it can be that, phasers and things you've never thought possible, just depends on where you go in Felarya and what you're dealing with. Also keep in mind weapons are good for human sized or slightly larger targets...but giants? They tend to be impervious or at least highly resistant to most weapons. Reflexes,Knowledge and Luck are you allies in the jungle, traveler.



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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Fri Jun 05, 2015 9:34 am

Actually, manga weapons weren't very detailed, so I assumed that they were modern weapons such as shot guns or assault rifles. (Like the Ak-74 Looking thing in Hard Choices).

Although, I guess the best weapon in Felarya if you happened to go there is your mind, and a knowledge of the preds and their behavior! It would make for a great guide book, just put the wiki in a book!

Phasers may be rare, so I guess I could keep my ideas to a more classical approach. Plus Crossbows can be just as good as guns in some situations! If you've ever been around a well-made crossbow IRL, it can really do some damage from medium to close range and kill with one shot.

To those who said guns/ranged weapons won't be very effective, What about hitting the Pred's weak points? They all have them! Either wings, female sensitive areas, or eyes. Even if you got something like a bullet or shotgun frag in your eye, it would probably be like if a human got dust in their eye. Then any prey could escape while the pred tries to get it out.

(If anyone is wondering why i'm doing this specific details is beacuse soon, if time allows, this summer I'd like to begin writing Felarya stories and poetry. My aim is to give readers more depth to Felarya and make them feel what it would be like to go there. Of course, I'm still in the process of getting permission, but once i get a green light, i hope you will enjoy! Also I think im going to make a crossbow a common weapon for reasons stated above.)
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Fri Jun 05, 2015 10:20 am

Easier said than done, bub. Easier said than fucking done. Think about it, any good predator will not give its prey a chance to fight back if it can help it. That's why they're good at camouflage and ambush. This is what makes them such a dangerous threat. On top of being gigantic, they are far more intelligent than a common beast, and therefore can think of more complex strategies to catch food. For example, they can single out who is the biggest threat in an adventuring party with just basic information and common sense.

Let's say a smart naga spots an adventuring party. Two are totting swords and spears, two are toting bows and arrows, and two are toting tomes and staves. She won't jump at you as soon as they get within visual range, no, it's going to hide and analyze the situation. She can tell that the melee guys are no threat whatsoever, she can tell the archers are gonna be annoying, but only a little, and that the guys in the robes are the assholes that sling spells around and that they're obviously the biggest threat. With that in mind, she'll either wait until they get in the perfect position, or she gets in the perfect position, and once she sees an opening, she strikes before before they even know what hit them, going for the mages first because they're the biggest problem. She doesn't have to go for them all at once, she can snatch the mages, retreat before the rest of the party retaliates, and then plan her next move.

The same goes for fairies. Yes, their wings are an obvious weak point, but because it's such an obvious weakness, it means they're well aware of that fact and will do everything they can to make sure you can't exploit it. For one thing, they can shrink themselves, meaning they can hide virtually anywhere. From that hiding spot, which could be behind an innocuous flower, they can use spells to potentially put you to sleep, entangle you, or put you in any situation where you're incapacitated, at which point they have all the time in the world to shrink and eat you without a problem. Again, why should they give their prey a chance to hit their obvious weak point?

Hitting a harpy's wing is tricky. For starters, they fly, which means they are constantly on the move, which means they are hard to hit. Second, they are far bigger than any real birds. I can guarantee you that birdshots, the best type of shot for hunting birds, isn't gonna do shit because their bones are just so much bigger and more dense than real birds. It would be as effective as throwing sand at someone's arm. And then there's the issue of range. Harpies can fly very high, much higher than any weapon's effective range short of maybe a sniper rifle. If you can't hit with it, then that gun is useless.

You could use a heavy weapon like a stinger missile, which could plausibly take a giant down, but that has its own drawbacks. The biggest of which are small predators. Felarya isn't home to just giant predators, there are also small predators who no doubt like to wolf pack their preys. Your big-ass bazooka isn't gonna be so effective against those. In fact, it's going to slow you down horribly, and in the worst case scenario if your trigger finger is especially itchy, will send you to an early, explosion induced grave.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Fri Jun 05, 2015 12:16 pm

Dragon Eaten by Her wrote:
To those who said guns/ranged weapons won't be very effective, What about hitting the Pred's weak points? They all have them! Either wings

Using logic like this has kept pred's bellies full for a long time. XD Species weaknesses are not always constant. Look at Natalie created by Powerman5000. Her wings are breakable....but not without allot force! Add to this she loves fighting and can go "super fairy" when she gets bored with you? Yeaaah. Not convinced? Let's see Clare's a Terrestrial naga so may think you can get her with water right? Bzzzk! Wrong. She'd just be wet and confused. Let's see...Ooh how about we get out of weaknesses being patched over and get into preds who use tech and magic to get YOU before you get them. As seen in in Prinny's fic Ruin Run I think it was: http://prinnydood-abides.deviantart.com/art/Ruin-Run-441384594 Kemsiyet is able to use her brute strength to make trouble for the heroes and
SPOILS A BIT OF THIS FIC DON'T CLICK IF NOT READ:
 
Quick Wits and Powerful Magic are good but don't always win the battles. Often in Felarya actually luck is the judge, jury and executioner and weirdly? It's the one place you can control this force or at least influence it a little but nobody seems to think of that.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:05 pm

Quote :
To those who said guns/ranged weapons won't be very effective, What about hitting the Pred's weak points? They all have them! Either wings, female sensitive areas, or eyes. Even if you got something like a bullet or shotgun frag in your eye, it would probably be like if a human got dust in their eye. Then any prey could escape while the pred tries to get it out.

Remember that preds can still move if something hits them in a sensitive area. they dont want to let their prey escape no matter what, so all you may be doing is encouraging a predator to flail wildly. You don't want that no matter what, and you especially dont want a naga to flail wildly. XD

Quote :
Phasers may be rare, so I guess I could keep my ideas to a more classical approach. Plus Crossbows can be just as good as guns in some situations! If you've ever been around a well-made crossbow IRL, it can really do some damage from medium to close range and kill with one shot.

Part of me wants to say no to phasers and disruptors/disintigrators, but realistically anyone with that technology who gets lost in felarya will have it. keep in mind ammo/batteries/etc. The vishmitals dont have that tech but even if they did they wouldn't hand it over. Honestly advanced technology will only be useful until you run out of ammo or batteries because you will not find that anywhere else, I can almost guarantee that, which is why bringing phasers and the like dont really work so much.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Fri Jun 05, 2015 10:54 pm

Quote :
Quote :
To those who said guns/ranged weapons won't be very effective, What about hitting the Pred's weak points? They all have them! Either wings, female sensitive areas, or eyes. Even if you got something like a bullet or shotgun frag in your eye, it would probably be like if a human got dust in their eye. Then any prey could escape while the pred tries to get it out.

Hitting their weak points is more like to create an opportunity for easier escaping, or too make the pred turn away because they see you not worth the risk. If you want to go all out against a predator with the intent to kill, you should be a lot well-equipped and has the right strategy, which is often something the preys either don't have, or lose due to surprise factor from the pred.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 3:01 am

It seems to me, much of the People around don´t realize the Effects of Fireguns, do they? Imagine being hitted by a Metal Projectile with a Speed of around 600m/sec (less by Pistols - up to about 900m/sec by Rifles). The pure Impact Power is more than 1000hp right on the Area of about 1 cm². And this can go up to about 17000hp by Big Game Guns.

So even for a Giant a Shot in the Eye is much more than just `Dust in the Eye´ for a normal Being. Because an Organ able to sense Things has to be sensitive itself. So logically there is not much of an `Armour´ or something like that.

If You hit there, this Guy has much other Problems than going after You, You can believe me that. Even a gigantic human-sized Skull is not as massive as that of an Elephant or a Rhinoceros due to it´s Design - and if You have a Gun like a .338Lapua or a .416Rigby the Probability is high for the Bullet going straight through the Eye into the Brain. So if You have a mere M-4 or a HK G-3 with military Ammo (5,56mm or 7,62mm NATO Steelcore) You can hit them really hard. These Things can easily go through Brick Walls and Car Motors - so even if You `only´ hit them elsewhere, this would be pretty nasty for them. I bet they would think about leaving You alone just a Second later.  

The only Problem is: You have to be accurate in Stress Situations (and being chased by a living Avalanche with bad Habits can be pretty stressy) - or You have to be stealthy. Then a Sniper Gun like a Ruger R-93 Tactical, a WA-2000 or a Dragunov would be the right Choice.

Even better would be a .50BMG Fortmeyer or a Barrett - then You can have Wolfram Core or even High Explosive Ammo as well - and this would be the Point, where the real Fun starts. If You are the Guy behind this Gun of Course.

The absolute Royal Class would be an Anzio Gun for 20mm VULCAN Ammo - or a 20mm Denel Rifle. A 20mm Solothurn 18-1000 Panzerbüchse or a japanese Type 97 20mm Anti Tank Gun would also be neat.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 4:36 am

I agree with Bandur Khan you guys aren't really taking into account ballistics. kinetic energy against fleshy targets can cause some pretty horrific damage.

Another thing I would like to add...Making the use of gun powder (Even your Nito materials base smokeless powder that modern guns use today) is relatively easy if you know what chemicals to put together. In a fantasy setting...go to an alchemist or a chemist for that then learn it yourself. Though as said by many others on and off the internet. This is an experts profession and work, not easy and very dangerous, but once you learn it you will know how to make a lot of it.


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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 4:50 am

I like how none of you guys take into account that in order to shoot a giant in its eye or Weak Spot (tm), it would imply that she didn't ambush you or incapacitate you prior to, you know, lining up your shot and pulling the trigger. This may be news to you, but aiming when stressed is hard, and when you have Godzilla locked on you, it's pretty fucking stressful.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 5:22 am

I think that by now most people do realize a gunshot can pretty much penetrate a predator's skin (also, talking about taurs and Giants here, not predatory beasts) since it's been discussed many times in the chatbox. However, you have to take into account various things just to have the weapon with you.

1) You have to actually get the gun. Obviously, if you come from another world there's a bigger chance you can have one, but if you want to find one in Negav or Felarya in general, good luck finding the big, specialized weapons Bandur is mentioning. The most common you'll get are pistols and regular rifles/machine guns, big ass guns will be rarer and rarer the more specialized they are (like a sniper rifle).

2) You have to get the ammo. Yes, this seems like it's a bit stupid, but actually finding the right ammos for the right gun is tricky in a world that focuses on past age tech. You'll find a good array of ammo for the common pistols and firearms, but getting more specific and flashy ammo for the big guns becomes increasingly difficult. Remember also supply and demand; the Negav dealer will probably get a lot more profit from a handful of pistol bullets that are popular than from one or two bullets of the big boys, which rarely sell and take up the same amount of space.

3) You have to actually carry all of that in a trip through the jungle. You know, it's all wet, dirty and a bit difficult to tread through. And the guns and ammo weight a lot, on top of all the survival gear you're carrying (rations and such). Pistols and light firearms are more common because they are easier to carry both in the bulk they make and the amount they weight.

4) You have to maintain your firearm for it to be in good shape when firing. I have to admit I don't know much about this, but besides a few honourable exceptions, most weapons don't handle rainfall and dust very well, don't they?

For all these points, a more primitive weapon is more convenient. A sword or a bow are easily found, you can find arrows or bolts very well, even make them yourself, they arguably weight less than firearms, and they need far less maintenance than them. And are definitely less complicated and easier to understand. Makes it easy to see why the natives prefer them over more modern weapons.



Bandur Khan wrote:
Even a gigantic human-sized Skull is not as massive as that of an Elephant or a Rhinoceros due to it´s Design
Well, taking into account that an average human is about as big as a giant taur's finger, we can safely say that a giant skull is a bit smaller than the whole Rhinoceros. So trust me on this, you'll have a hard time penetrating a preds's skull. Sure, eyes, nose, back of the head are weak points, but you have to first get a shot through there, which is hard, and second, you need a very, very good aim to do good damage. Remember that a bullet, even with all their kinetic energy, is very, very small for a Giant, which tends to mean most of the damage is done in a straight, very thin line that is comparatively thinner than a needle. There are people who got nails stuck through their cranium and survived, and true, a needle through an eye sounds horrifying, but certainly not overly damaging unless the pred acts very stupidly. To get positively life-threatening hits, you'd need something that explodes or fragmentates. Or very, very thick bullets.

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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:40 pm

Quote :
1) You have to actually get the gun. Obviously, if you come from another world there's a bigger chance you can have one, but if you want to find one in Negav or Felarya in general, good luck finding the big, specialized weapons Bandur is mentioning. The most common you'll get are pistols and regular rifles/machine guns, big ass guns will be rarer and rarer the more specialized they are (like a sniper rifle).

2) You have to get the ammo. Yes, this seems like it's a bit stupid, but actually finding the right ammos for the right gun is tricky in a world that focuses on past age tech. You'll find a good array of ammo for the common pistols and firearms, but getting more specific and flashy ammo for the big guns becomes increasingly difficult. Remember also supply and demand; the Negav dealer will probably get a lot more profit from a handful of pistol bullets that are popular than from one or two bullets of the big boys, which rarely sell and take up the same amount of space.

Agreed. I think 'specialized' is a bit of an understatement which implies Negav will actually have it. Those types of guns are specific to Earth - our world. Technologies from other more connected worlds are a lot different, and if you hail from the Delurans or the Vishmitals its one thing - but you're in a military at that point and not going to be trekking out deep into the jungle in search of treasure. You're there to try and claim felarya's resources, and therefore are less likely to be outright fighting a predator anyway.

Anyone else wont be having the gun. You'd need to pry it off a vishmital or deluran's cold dead hands, and if your character can face down a well trained squad of specialized military personnel from a world (they'll be getting the right supplies from) is difficult. Then you'd have to find a way to resupply the gun you stole from their comrade's dead body.

Otherwise if you come here randomly, you'll just run out of ammo pretty quickly. Take into account supply, if you come from a random world, Negav will NOT be supplying your ammo type.

Quote :
3) You have to actually carry all of that in a trip through the jungle. You know, it's all wet, dirty and a bit difficult to tread through. And the guns and ammo weight a lot, on top of all the survival gear you're carrying (rations and such). Pistols and light firearms are more common because they are easier to carry both in the bulk they make and the amount they weight.

4) You have to maintain your firearm for it to be in good shape when firing. I have to admit I don't know much about this, but besides a few honourable exceptions, most weapons don't handle rainfall and dust very well, don't they?

If I wasn't already reinforcing Ilceren enough, you have to take into account as well that many guns will jam up when they get mud in them. The most reliable is the legendary AK-47, which you can drop, get mud in, and probably get run over by something and still probably manage to fire the f***ing thing. Still, *most* guns jam up pretty bad.

The second which is probably the most important, is the economy of Negav. If you're an adventurer, your payout will go mostly toward supplies (and repairs) and maybe medical attention if you barely survived a terrible experience, which may be half the time. After that, your profits. You'll need somewhere to live, so you'll be paying bills. You'd need to save up money to buy the gun.

This gun that is so advanced, if you could manage to actually *find* one in the first place, will likely be tens of thousands of Skevols. If you're buying on the black market (which, if its THAT advanced, you likely will be, and if you can find the market in the first place), then you'll be paying even more. Haggling might not be an option either, because any local gangs/mafia lords who control parts of the markets will likely have people to enforce that they're not getting ripped off by some silver tongued adventurer.

Now, if you can get through all this, still manage to keep the gun, and it in good condition (maintenance of the gun I dont think I addressed at all either), then go ahead, by all means. Just remember it'll be loud, and finding a suppressor will be another nightmare I'd wager. Unless you get super duper lucky.

This is why most people go for magic. Its more accessible, and can do more damage. It can also help you escape if you can get creative.

Also as Shady_Knight mentioned - the most important factor above all this - is that the predators you're up against are also thinking breathing sapient creatures. They can reason, and they have very tuned instincts from living in the jungle you're traversing their whole life. There's a good reason why there's such a huge mortality rate.
---

Of course nothing is set in stone. You could get very lucky for any of these points I made. Or Ilceren's. Its always possible, just the chance of it I'd argue as being highly unlikely though.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:50 pm

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This is why most people go for magic. Its more accessible, and can do more damage. It can also help you escape if you can get creative.
I won't disagree that magic is more versatile when you know what you're doing, but as for being more accessible, no, I disagree with that.  If you're talking about magic items with simple command words and such like a staff or a wand, then fair enough, they're essentially guns of a different shape, but actual robe and pointy hat wizards are not so common.  A mage in Negav is essentially a scientist whose specialty revolves around magic, not just a bog standard magic user, so not everyone is going to have the talent to easily attain this level of knowledge and expertise.  There's also the issue of some creatures being attuned to magic themselves, most notably fairies and nagas, and are therefore able to sniff out a magic user more easily because a stronger magical aura is obviously easier to detect than a weaker one.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:06 pm

Good point Shady, but the way I see it, you can buy a simple magic book at a book store for cheaper than a gun, and then practice basic magics yourself that at the worst will probably turn your hair a different color if it backfires, so you get used to the technique, then once practiced enough can apply to be a student at the academy. Its difficult to get in, but if you put in the work, I believe the payout is better.

That's for an actual mage though, magic staves and the like are closer to what I meant.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 3:35 pm

This is why I mentioned, that it is pretty difficult to be precise at aiming, while being chased by an Interstate-Greyhound-Bus made of living Flesh. It would have been helpful to read my  Post completely, I would say.

And I still think it also is difficult for a huge-ass Being in a pretty crammed Jungle to `ambush´ You without being noticed and making any Noise - they have to weigh Tons, I would presume. Unusual Clearings, broken Trees and Branches, fresh Leaves everywhere, trembling Ground and so on - and it has to be damn silent around You. Because naturally nothing alife wants to be spotted by something like that.

"Hey - do You hear that?"
"What? I can´t hear anything..."
"Yeah - and that is exactly what I mean - it´s too damn quiet around here."

Despite this, anyone, who has Experience with big animals can agree, You actually HEAR them breathing. And what if YOU are the one approaching from behind? Ever thought of that? Of Course it would be better to get the Heck out of there...

And then there is... the Smell. You know it - any huge Creature has a specific Smell, even a big Reptile - especially if it´s a carnivorous one. The bigger it is, the more present the specific Smell. Well, You can´t sense it - but most Spiders and Stuff would not like to crawl over Your Body while You sleep, because for them it smells like Butyric Acid. And if You are the small one, You surely could sense a specific Smell - even if the Preds among themselves wouldn´t be able to do so.

So I would say the ones being `specialized in Ambushes´ are actually the small Guys. I can guarantee You that. But if they can earn any Benefits from that against some Monster the Size of a friggin Liberty Ship... is another Issue.

If they find You while rampaging through the Green, it´s another Thing. And of Course there are smaller Predators around. How to deal with them would be up to the specific Character - but I think the common and popular `Universal-Soldier-Character´ would surely have an Idea for even that.

Of Course it is difficult to get, maintain and supply a modern Firearm in a World like this - but the Main Issue was for me opening Your Eyes for the huge Effects Projectile Weapons can cause after hearing some odd Stuff about `Sand in the Eyes´. That is the Main Purpose, why we invented them: To make big, ugly Holes in Things and nasty Guys we don´t like. Especially the ones bigger and nastier than us. That was all.
Oh yes: And even if the Bullet is stopped in the massive Mid-Crane after penetrating an Eye, I still think a Predator would have other recent Problems than chasing after You - well okay, how You get a `Bull´s-Eye´ would be up to You. And a Hole in the Eye still is a Hole in the Eye - it doesn´t matter, what Diameter it has. At least it hurts.

A Lot.

Otherwise - if You pull the Trigger in Panic and `spray´ the big Guy with a whole 20-Rd-Mag of .223Hornaby (hard to miss something huge that actually comes straight after You), even he/she/it/whatever would be in for a very nasty Surprise.

And how You get Your Big Game Gun and how to carry it around without mentioning and relying on the all-around lame shrinking-Magic-Trick certainly would be up to You too, would it not?  Very Happy

For `primitive´ Weaponry here some Advice: Get Yourself a friggin Crossbow and poison Your Bolts - and be in for some Fun - if You can run away pretty fast, that is. Well, a good Bow would have the same Effect, of Course.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 5:06 pm

The problem with running away is that you would likely run INTO the mouth of something else. Like running away from a Naga and hiding in a tree, only to find that it is the mouth of a dryad!

Plus, their is still the question of ammo. Crossbow bolts would slow you down and make noice, but if your out of ammo, your a snack!
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 5:30 pm

There's still a question of learning how to re sharpen a knife or a sword, if you want ammuntion you need to want to have magic that can basically make black hole bag of a sort (I.e. placing your items in another space but easily accessible) Better not be easy magic to learn though. I imagine this is how people with fire arms or ballistic weapons, as rare as you guys are making them sound get by.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:50 pm

dragon808tr wrote:
The problem with running away is that you would likely run INTO the mouth of something else. Like running away from a Naga and hiding in a tree, only to find that it is the mouth of a dryad!

Plus, their is still the question of ammo. Crossbow bolts would slow you down and make noice, but if your out of ammo, your a snack!
Wow. Just, wow. I don't think I've seen a reply this amazingly boneheaded in a long time, both of them.

First of all, Felarya is not a mosh pit of giant monsters. They're not so condensed that you'd run into one every five steps. They may be sapient, but they are still animalistic, and if they were this close to each other, they would fight fiercely for territory.

Second, I'll just link this. http://xxamaroqxx.deviantart.com/art/Narame-536424987 Yeah, those crossbow bolts on her legs sure look like they weigh a million tons. I'm astounded she's at all able to lift that leg with such an impossibly heavy load burdening it. Seriously, did you actually forget the biggest advantage of arrows and crossbow bolts? You can retrieve the ammo. You don't have to carry a hundred of those things just in case. Even with a firearm, a competent gunman knows how to conserve his ammo. Ammo for pistols and rifles are super small and easy to carry. At most you have an ammo belt around your waist, and two bandoliers. Nothing more. An even more competent gunman will also not shoot at everything that moves unless he's absolutely out of option. That means he won't shoot at that 50-foot-tall killer bear when it'd be more practical to go the long way around it.

Bluehorizon wrote:
There's still a question of learning how to re sharpen a knife or a sword

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1d/Sharpeningstone1.jpg

This is a whetstone. It's fairly lightweight, doesn't take a lot of space in your backpack, and if you got fifteen minutes to spare, you can use it to sharpen your sword or your knife. Just rub it against the blade 'til your arm drops.
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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 8:16 pm

True dat guns require ammo: so would anything other than a crank-powered air-ionizing laser. And even that would require regular crank-ups. We already know guns require maintenance, require ammo, require acquisition, and can be pretty hefty. But so would everything else if used to kill stuff.

Yes, if you hit the weak points, you'll do a world of damage with a gun. You can miss, but misses do exactly the same damage with whatever weapon you use. If accuracy were the key issue, you're best served using a gun, ANY gun, rather than a crossbow, a sling, or a tankapult that fires tanks. Rate of fire of guns is also the best. And ammo capacity of guns is also the best. That's why we use guns, because guns outperform everything else, except for other, better guns.

If you want the most common ranged weapon, it's probably the stone. A time-tested classic, for ages 3 and up, 100% reutilizable and at an affordable price. When you really need that extra oomph, you can upgrade to the sharp stone simply by chipping two stones together until they are sharp. You can even wrap the sharp stone in a sock to give it extra range!


Srsly though... I give the guns a lotta crap, but I'm sure there's no shortage of guns in Felarya.

If we go by common, then there's the Kensha Hussars, who cannot possibly have a shortage of guns, the Vishmitali, who couldn't possibly have a shortage of guns and the Isolon Fist, who definitely have no shortage of guns. And in the current draft, none of those factions is small. Depending on which is bigger, the gun they use will be the most common in Felarya, unless there's a bigger faction that has to be developed yet. The most common gun by number ought to be whatever the Vishmitali prefer, as they're an entire ethnic group.

Then again, not all guns see use at the same rate. I'm sure the Hussars have more chance to put their guns to use than the Fist (who probably see less action than the Hussars, given they are both smaller and work for a smaller group) or the Vish (who prefer to see no action at all). So the most commonly used gun would be whatever the Hussars are packing.

Everyone else may be packing something else- or they may be packing that very thing, simply because there's bound to be plenty of them to go around. We could do without retro guns, wouldn't make much of a difference in the grand scheme of things.

Shady Knight wrote:
Wow. Just, wow. I don't think I've seen a reply this amazingly boneheaded in a long time, both of them.
Watch it, please.

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PostSubject: Re: Felarya Weapons/Tech   Sat Jun 06, 2015 9:13 pm

Instead of just thinking about guns or swords or magic, why don't we try being creative and combine those things in different ways? For instance, I could see someone specializing in hunting/protecting from giant beasts enchanting their equipment to allow them to lift more and brandishing a giant blade which they can now wield as easily as any normal-sized blade, and focus on doing damage. Any giantess will probably be seriously deterred by losing a finger or toe to someone a hundredth of her size, as might lesser giant creatures, right? Higher risk, higher reward.

Alternatively, I could see someone modifying a firearm to produce and fire bullets made from Felarya's abundant ambient magic energy. I'm sure there's some pseudo-scientific method for magitech that draws in and condenses raw magic into a bullet-like form out there somewhere. May not deal as much damage as a real-steel bullet, but you'd have less to worry about ammunition-wise at least, which would be a plus, right? Less risk, but less reward, too.

Can anyone else come up with anything inventive?
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