I think therefore I am food

Pendragon wrote:

Obviously you've never met Steve Irwin. He could tame a bear, stop a lion, trip an elephant, etc. He was the animal version of Superman.

His only weakness was a fluke, if you ask me. Since Felarya is mostly land, he'd have the advantage, if he was still among us. Likewise, so many others are just like him, if not stronger.

Ahem... Steve Irwin was a champion. And I'd prefer not to speak about him if it's all the same to you - we're both Aussies.

Wait, so are you offended when I compliment him? Or do you rather not talk of him?

I'll move back to the topic from this, but what you just said completely confused me.

Well to me being labeled as 'food' just means your on the menu, some may see it as hopeless for they don't know how to cope with being prey, usually because we humans have been a dominant species for a long while, we've even been labeled as the most dangerous 'animal' on earth, and having our dominance taken away frightens alot of folks for to them absolute dominance means absolute power. However as many have said we don't have to give in to the dangerous preds of Felarya just because they're more dominant than us...

...But I'm possibly missin some key facts, so I'll be quite now and litsen to you guys...

To Raetsu: Couldn't say it any better myself. Pretty good analysis on the psychological angle of this interesting dilemma. Humans becoming prey is like getting our balls cut as a species...but, only if you see it that way.

I think its also important to note that what most people find disturbing about Felarya is the size the monsters... there used to dealing with ones there own size....

After all it takes intelligence to be a monster, a hulking brute of a mammal reptile or insect is just a predator. Nagas, dridders, harpies, and such are the monsters... but then so are humans. What really strikes a cord with me is that the pred mentality has little to no difference from our own, its a willful presumption of order over other living things. what really scares the average person is the realization that there presumption is wrong... and that someone else is indeed holder of it. after this realization all there rationals for the sparing of there life are pathetically inadequate because they themselves would likely disregard them too...

My point is that no monster movie is ever about the 'thing' and this is a very important point. Its always about the monster, the humans.

To Cypress: That's pretty illuminating; it makes sense. Imgaine if a human asked-not begged-to be spared. But not for the whole "because-I'm-alive" shill or the "because-you're-human-too-just-very-big" bromide. But, instead, that they share the same worldview-the whole idea of there being "higher animals". That he wouldn't hesitate to do what the pred was about to do. That, in that way, they were the same.

truth is point blank i never want to live in felarya because i know id die

also humans were really only truly organized greatly when cro-magnums were here and that was because of their brute strength and small intelligients

actually i am more arguing thats why they are incapable of successfully begging/arguing for there lives most times. they would have no way to ague against the preconceptions they had been building up there whole lives in those precious few seconds... though it would be interesting to see them try... thats why i think those without that pre construct or those who work against it have a better chance. Take lea as example, it was her lack of reaction to her captors as well as general outlook that got her a large friend.

bigman27622 wrote:

truth is point blank i never want to live in felarya because i know id die

also humans were really only truly organized greatly when cro-magnums were here and that was because of their brute strength and small intelligients

Frankly, you'll die in the real world too... It might just take a little longer due to the lack of things that eat people.

I don't se how you say that humanity was only truly organized in the stone ages... Sure, they needed teamwork to survive much more than we do today, but there have been many other times when that has been the case. During any time of famine, humans have had to band together for survival and those who would shun the pack were the first to die. The same would go for any situation where survival is difficult.

Though when you get down to it, this necessity of cooperation is only natural. We're pack hunter/scavengers after all. Probably why in the wild, we're pretty much on equal terms with dogs (and sometimes wolves).

To Cypress: I understand now: you were saying that it was PRECISELY because of that few even have a chance. Basically explaining the "why" to the "what". Another thing to consider is that, the fact is, befriending a pred is nigh impossible-not something one can really count on. That's kind of glossed over. ^^;

Personally, the best approach is to accept this new order of things, and live accordingly-rather fight it, work within it.

Here's a thought: Are we all REALLY so sure of our dominance?
Are we all so unfamiliar with typical horror movies and ignorant of accidents that we can't accept the fact that the world is dangerous? Are we too high-strung to accept the ideas that some things will want to eat us now?

Are we all REALLY so cocky as to argue that they can't eat us because we're human?


My answer? No.

GREGOLE wrote:

Here's a thought: Are we all REALLY so sure of our dominance?
Are we all so unfamiliar with typical horror movies and ignorant of accidents that we can't accept the fact that the world is dangerous? Are we too high-strung to accept the ideas that some things will want to eat us now?

Are we all REALLY so cocky as to argue that they can't eat us because we're human?


My answer? No.

My answer: Are we talking about about humans collectively (which I try not to do) or individually (which I think is the most accurate approach)? Collectively, I'd have to disagree with you: I think the majority of people would be cocky enough to use that argument, effective or not. The majority of people are comfortable with our relatively idyllic lives: why else do you think armies have such intensive training programs? To break people of their creature comforts and assurances.

What you were mentioning were impersonal accidents, horror films, and wild animals: not a personal encounter with a sentient predator.

Individually, however, I think there are those who are not that presumptuous. The fact is, it takes a certain kind of person to survive in Felarya: and that kind of person is VERY rare.

Allow me to quote Men in Black, when Jay and Kay were discussing why aliens are kept a under wraps:

Jay: Why the big secret? People are smart, they can handle it.
Kay: A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it.

I think that about sums up my position. I'm not pessimistic, but that doesn't mean I think everyone and their grandma can make it in Felarya.

To everyone: Please don't turn this thread into a Men in Black discussion.

Quote :

Jay: Why the big secret? People are smart, they can handle it.
Kay: A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky, dangerous animals and you know it.

Very true.

But most prey beings in Felarya are persons, not people.

And few persons will pull any of that "You can't eat me because I'm human and that's against the rules!" garbage we keep seeing.

We know bears, crocodiles, lions, snakes, komodo dragons, orcas(maybe not recorded but I do NOT trust those bastards!) sometimes eat us and we don't question it.
We know dinosaurs, were they given access to us, would eat us.
Heck, we accept that sometimes cannibals eat us.

I don't think it would be that hard for an individual to accept their new place on the food chain. Different world, different inhabitants, different order.
It's not nearly as hard to accept as it's made out to be.

We may try to assert our dominance, but VERY few persons will try to reason their way out of being eaten with the kind of self-righteousness that some preds like Elle seem to invariably encounter.

Quote :

To everyone: Please don't turn this thread into a Men in Black discussion.

Edgardbug PWNs.

These points are all very true.

My philosophy is that you can do one of two things in Felarya:

-Either you can maintain your humanity, respecting all creatures and such.

-Or you can become the very monster that even predators fear.

There are people in both categories when you really think about it. So predators may wish to be careful who they pick out for a snack.

To GREGOLE: I agree that it would not be hard for an individual to accept the new order of things. However, Kay's statement implies that many PERSONS wouldn't be able to hack the truth: after all, a group wouldn't exist without it's individual members.

So, a lot of PERSONS try to reason their way out with that tired argument: Kay's implicit point is that it takes an EXCEPTIONAL person to handle something Earth-shattering.

Siafu789 wrote:

Individually, however, I think there are those who are not that presumptuous. The fact is, it takes a certain kind of person to survive in Felarya: and that kind of person is VERY rare.

I think you are wrong there. People, when faced with adversity and challenged, no matter how stupid or unfit, will show amazing cunning and strength when needed.

Icalasari wrote:

I think you are wrong there. People, when faced with adversity and challenged, no matter how stupid or unfit, will show amazing cunning and strength when needed.

I think we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I'm sorry, but I think these stressful situations don't PRODUCE survivors: they SEPERATE the strong from the weak, the smart from the dumb, the fit from the unfit.

Sorry if I seemed a bit...pushy in my response. I'm not insulting your position, I just strongly disagree with it.

Quote :

I think we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I'm sorry, but I think these stressful situations don't PRODUCE survivors: they SEPERATE the strong from the weak, the smart from the dumb, the fit from the unfit.

You're both right.

Stressful situations are capable of awakening latent survivor traits in an individual, but the potential for them has to be there in the first place, and it's not always there.

GREGOLE wrote:

Quote :

I think we're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I'm sorry, but I think these stressful situations don't PRODUCE survivors: they SEPERATE the strong from the weak, the smart from the dumb, the fit from the unfit.

You're both right.

Stressful situations are capable of awakening latent survivor traits in an individual, but the potential for them has to be there in the first place, and it's not always there.

I see! What you're saying is that we're not opposed on the issues, but that one is merely a clarification of the other.

I agree. You're right: Felarya can awaken the survivor within, but only if that person is even able to.

I just had a thought: in a way, the predators help. Whether they realize it or not, whenever they eat a group of incompetents, they leave the competent free to breed-of course, lineage is no guarantee of survival.

I would be inclined to say given enough time, a human could reset there ideas and survive. though the time necessary would be variable. oddly though i would think that those weaker than average would take less time to appreciate the new order of things because they were already in a lower tier of human order... though they are likely to be eaten sooner as well. also as far as intellect goes, pure knowledge is often not a good thing as it too can make you feel superior. however people with applied learning would tend to do better... but the biggest variable is emotional outlook. those who tend to focus on them selves will likely take longer to conclude necessary ideas where as those who think more in a group sense will catch on much quicker.

To Cypress: Personally, I think a group-oriented person would be more vulnerable than someone who looks out for number one. What is this group oriented person going to do when he/she is all alone, with no-one to count on but their own selves? Like I said before, I do not support the "screw everyone else" or the "everyone is a means to an end" approach. That approach actually weakens the individual, as they will be decimated when they have no-one to be their personal Red Shirt. Think more rugged individualist: determined, intelligent, multi-skilled, and self-reliant most importantly. That is why right person for Felarya is so rare: because the rugged individualist is very rare.

As for knowledge, the applicability of knowledge depends on what you intend to accomplish. This depends on goal and context. Thus, whether knowledge is "pure" or "applied" isn't axiomatic.

Pendragon wrote:

-Or you can become the very monster that even predators fear.

Problem is, most 'Humans' capable of such aren't 'Human' anymore. They tend to be Homosapien Supernus.

Fear is a powerful tool when used properly. However, striking fear into a Predator would be nigh impossible for something human sized. You can't rely on size (Except to maybe put the Pred off-balance), nor can you rely on strength (As let's face it, 100ft Snake > Human in strength, no matter how much training they have in such fields).

You'd be best off putting fear into fellow humans and using that to keep yourself secure.

Malahite wrote:

Fear is a powerful tool when used properly. However, striking fear into a Predator would be nigh impossible for something human sized. You can't rely on size (Except to maybe put the Pred off-balance), nor can you rely on strength (As let's face it, 100ft Snake > Human in strength, no matter how much training they have in such fields).

I don't think it's necessary to be the bigger or the stronger to survive, if we compare us next to the natural abilities of many animals we are very weak physically by example a lion run faster and has a better reaction. But the main weapon of a human is his ability with his both hands, as it had been said we developped many things like weapons and traps to survive. I think is possible to humans to strike fear into predator if they succeed to oppose a solid resistance. I mean strategy and teamwork.

I pose the question: is striking fear even necessary, or even desirable? I mean, think about it: if they didn't merely think we were insignificant, but dangerous, the Guardians would come down faster than a plane going Mach 5. Plus, what's the purpose? To intimidate?

Staying out of sight, and not looking for trouble seems to be the smartest approach.

agreed out of sight means out of mind means out of stomach.... however, I believe the number one method of survival of a smaller species is to build up interdependency that is beneficial to both a pred and human *cough the bowl cough* symbiosis is a powerful law of nature, rivaling that of 'big thing eat small thing" XD this is not to be confused with a parasitic relationship... which is one sided.