General Q and A

but wouldnt something like compressed plasma rounds *refer to halo first strike* cause serious damage>.< espeacily if the race was as advance or more advance than the forerunners would the weapons they would have would seem like heavy hitting to Felarayan Military units while to their race would seem like light infantry weapons when compared to their own military units and heavy weapons. even through the "infantry" weapon has the ablity to take down a M1A1 MBT. in 3 or so shots on a moderate energy range zone ( reference ,go to Black Hole Fragment for further details)
Or wouldnt something like the Partical beam rifle still do serious harm even through the round is small but highly penatriating and would therory enter the pred and exit the pred?

( i think this needs to be taken to the chat box so we can talk in real time and so i can get my bro to frecking stop asking me to ask you these things >.<)

luke112 wrote:

but wouldnt something like compressed plasma rounds *refer to halo first strike* cause serious damage>.<

Simple physics generally dictates that if you want a plasma shot to have comparable damage to a solid shot, it must transfer a similar amount of energy. This means you must first generate that energy, so plasma weapons first require extremely powerful and efficient generators.

Plasma is actually not that good of a weapon against beings mostly made of water, since they work by heating things up, and water has a high specific heat (how much energy is required to raise its temperature by a certain amount.).

luke112 wrote:

espeacily if the race was as advance or more advance than the forerunners would the weapons they would have would seem like heavy hitting to Felarayan Military units while to their race would seem like light infantry weapons when compared to their own military units and heavy weapons. even through the "infantry" weapon has the ablity to take down a M1A1 MBT. in 3 or so shots on a moderate energy range zone ( reference ,go to Black Hole Fragment for further details)

I think you should read the guideline for Felarya, specifically the bits about overpowered characters. A "more advanced than the forerunners" civilization with "light infantry weapons that can take down a main battle tank in three shots" veers dangerously close (at least in my opinion) to a sort of Mary-Sue/Uber-Powerful-Character sort of mix.

Or, to be frank; a civilization that is advanced enough that their infantry carry weapons that can trivially destroy battle tanks would decimate everything and anything they could find in Felarya, with very few exceptions. But such a civilization both goes against the style of Felarya, and is boring to read about*.
1. It goes against the style of Felarya, because Felarya is supposed to be a dangerous place. With weapons that powerful, it is no longer dangerous.
2. It is boring to read about, because every difficultly they face is trivial to solve. Being threatened by a giant naga? Have just one of the infantryman shoot it once or twice. Problem solved. Being threatened by dozens of them? Ask the same infantryman to shoot them a little more rapidly. Problem solved. Being threatened by an army of them? Have the infantrymen's buddies join in. Problem solved. Running out of food and water? Go raid a nearby village; you can take it by force since they certainly don't have anything to stop you with. Problem solved.

When you have that much power, almost everything has the trivial solution of "use your huge amount of power to get what you want." And that's boring to read about.

luke112 wrote:

Or wouldnt something like the Partical beam rifle still do serious harm even through the round is small but highly penatriating and would therory enter the pred and exit the pred?

No, actually the major problem when using human weapons against predators is not that the projectiles do not penetrate far enough (an unmodified AK-47 can hit some of the pred's vital organs if fired from a close distance); it is that they simply do not do enough damage. For example, consider a 9mm bullet hitting a human in the torso, passing through one of the lungs and out the back, but not hitting a major artery in the lung. Assuming they apply some pressure to that wound, it is not likely that they will die from it, because the small open blood vessels will clot (so they won't bleed out), and even if that lung is entirely disabled, the person still has a second, fully functioning one to fall back on. (They might die of infection though). Scale that 9mm bullet up to predator size, and you will see that it has a diameter measured in FEET, not millimeters. So in order to do similar or greater levels of damage, one will need to create a hole with about the same diameter. But your 9mm pistol will still just create a small hole in the predator, just like it would in a person.

A particle beam rifle powerful enough to go entirely through a predator, but with a beam diameter of say an 1/8th of an inch would be the equivalent of stabbing a human with a long needle thinner than any needle found in a sewing kit. It might pierce arteries and veins, but the holes it would produce would instantly clot.



*-Actually, there are ways to make Uber Powerful Characters/Civilizations interesting to read about, but they are trickier to write and generally focus on something the UPC is not uber at, or by adding "chains" to the UPC to being them back under control.

Quote :

No, actually the major problem when using human weapons against predators is not that the projectiles do not penetrate far enough (an unmodified AK-47 can hit some of the pred's vital organs if fired from a close distance); it is that they simply do not do enough damage. For example, consider a 9mm bullet hitting a human in the torso, passing through one of the lungs and out the back, but not hitting a major artery in the lung. Assuming they apply some pressure to that wound, it is not likely that they will die from it, because the small open blood vessels will clot (so they won't bleed out), and even if that lung is entirely disabled, the person still has a second, fully functioning one to fall back on. (They might die of infection though). Scale that 9mm bullet up to predator size, and you will see that it has a diameter measured in FEET, not millimeters. So in order to do similar or greater levels of damage, one will need to create a hole with about the same diameter. But your 9mm pistol will still just create a small hole in the predator, just like it would in a person.

A particle beam rifle powerful enough to go entirely through a predator, but with a beam diameter of say an 1/8th of an inch would be the equivalent of stabbing a human with a long needle thinner than any needle found in a sewing kit. It might pierce arteries and veins, but the holes it would produce would instantly clot.

I must get this out of the way, I have a group of technologically advanced humans who use gauss weaponry as their main armaments. To give an idea of the size of their projectiles, their equivalent to the 5.56 NATO is a 3 mm wide x 60 mm long depleted U-238 needle. What I get from your statement is that it wouldn't be all that effective even against a human, let alone a predator, since the round diameter is so tiny.

Sean Okotami wrote:

Quote :

No, actually the major problem when using human weapons against predators is not that the projectiles do not penetrate far enough (an unmodified AK-47 can hit some of the pred's vital organs if fired from a close distance); it is that they simply do not do enough damage. For example, consider a 9mm bullet hitting a human in the torso, passing through one of the lungs and out the back, but not hitting a major artery in the lung. Assuming they apply some pressure to that wound, it is not likely that they will die from it, because the small open blood vessels will clot (so they won't bleed out), and even if that lung is entirely disabled, the person still has a second, fully functioning one to fall back on. (They might die of infection though). Scale that 9mm bullet up to predator size, and you will see that it has a diameter measured in FEET, not millimeters. So in order to do similar or greater levels of damage, one will need to create a hole with about the same diameter. But your 9mm pistol will still just create a small hole in the predator, just like it would in a person.

A particle beam rifle powerful enough to go entirely through a predator, but with a beam diameter of say an 1/8th of an inch would be the equivalent of stabbing a human with a long needle thinner than any needle found in a sewing kit. It might pierce arteries and veins, but the holes it would produce would instantly clot.

I must get this out of the way, I have a group of technologically advanced humans who use gauss weaponry as their main armaments. To give an idea of the size of their projectiles, their equivalent to the 5.56 NATO is a 3 mm wide x 60 mm long depleted U-238 needle. What I get from your statement is that it wouldn't be all that effective even against a human, let alone a predator, since the round diameter is so tiny.

That is the downside to gauss-guns/railguns. They're really only effective against armor. If you use them against a fleshy target, they tend to just pierce straight through instead of discharging their energy on the target itself. Also, their effectiveness is dependent on being able to generate enough power to propel the projectile at extreme speeds. You generally can't pack that kind of power source into a handheld infantry weapon, and if you could, the output would be so low that it would not be much better than a standard firearm.

Keep in mind, force = mass x acceleration. You can have something go really fast, but if it doesn't have a lot of mass, it isn't going to deliever much force (exceptions include micro-meteorites since they are travelling at astronomical speeds). I think math would have to be done on your weapon to determine how much force it delievers. The effects of a kinetic weapon really do depend on the speed and mass of the projectile.

Also, Luke, infantry weapons that could easily kill a main battle tank are just impractical. People would just stop making tanks, and then the weapon would be completely useless, since anti-tank weapons generally are not good against infantry. Also, not even some of the more military-focused sci-fi settings have weapons that unbalanced. It isn't like a space marine can go up and kill a Leman-Russ tank with his bolter.

But yeah, as an energy weapon it falls into the same trap as lasers and beam weaponry. You cannot have a power source that small generate that much power. The smallest thing you could mount that kind of weapon on would probably be another tank.

Given that most of their foes use armor, I guess that's not that big of a deal, and I usually handwave how it works by saying that their technology is advanced enough to propel a uranium needle at Mach 2 out of an assault rifle. Granted, if they wanted to kill a giant predator for whatever reason, they wouldn't even bother with the rifle, they'd just go straight for the anti-tank missiles, so I guess my problem is inconsequential.

Sean Okotami wrote:

I must get this out of the way, I have a group of technologically advanced humans who use gauss weaponry as their main armaments. To give an idea of the size of their projectiles, their equivalent to the 5.56 NATO is a 3 mm wide x 60 mm long depleted U-238 needle. What I get from your statement is that it wouldn't be all that effective even against a human, let alone a predator, since the round diameter is so tiny.

3mm width isn't that much smaller than 5.56mm, I certainly wouldn't want a 3mm hole punched in me.

Make it so that their anti-personal needles tumble/fragment/mushroom after impact; all of those will decrease penetration depth and increase wound channel size (because all of those increase the drag). Fragmenting in particular could be really nasty and effective, like a shotgun blast at point blank range. Fragmenting would probably be good against humans, but some sort of mushrooming would probably be better against giants, because you will need significant amounts of penetration to damage a giant's vital organs, and even at mach 2 I think a fragmenting round would slow down too much.

It occurred to me to do some math, and here is how it works out.
I assume your bullets to be cylinders, not needles, for ease of computation. This overstates their mass by some amount, and thus increases the total energy they have to work with. A width of 3mm and a length of 60mm translates into a radius of 1.5mm (0.0015 m) and a length of 60mm (0.06 m). The volume of a cylinder is "Volume = pi * radius^2 * length", so your needles have a volume of 4.24 * 10^-7 m^3 (0.000000424 cubic meters). The density of uranium is 19.1 grams per cubic centimeter, which is equal to 19100 kilograms per cubic meter, so the mass of your needles is "volume * density" which is 0.00810059 kg (8.1 grams). The speed of sound is 343.2 meters per second, and Mach 2 is twice that, so the velocity they are traveling is 686.4 meters per second. The kinetic energy of a projectile that is traveling well under the speed of light is "1/2 * mass * velocity^2", so your needles have a kinetic energy of 1908.27 joules at the muzzle. For reference 5.56 × 45 mm (NATO)(M16 uses these) rounds have a muzzle energy of 1,796 joules, and 7.62 × 39 mm rounds (the type the AK-47 fires) have a muzzle energy of 2,070, so the amount of damage you can do is more or less the same as the amount of damage an AK-47 or M16 shot can do (though since you are using depleted uranium, your standard shots will be pretty decent at penetrating armor, and less good at damaging soft targets).

Interestingly, the AK-47 fires its bullets FASTER than Mach 2, and the M16 fires at Mach 2.7, so you might want to increase the speed at which the needles travel, or else your statement "I usually handwave how it works by saying that their technology is advanced enough to propel a uranium needle at Mach 2 out of an assault rifle." is equivalent to saying "Their technology is as advanced as 1949 Earth technology." (I know, not entirely fair because the Earth guns use chemical reactions to work and your dudes use gauss guns, but still...)(Also a fast speed means less bullet drop over a given distance, making it easier to aim at a distance.)

Well I know nothing about usual bullet velocity, so I should probably remove any mention of velocity to make things easier on myself. Also, they don't usually use frag rounds, just solid projectiles for penetrating armor, because their foes are usually armored, and they're designed to penetrate that armor. Although infantry soldiers sometimes come packing with explosive rounds. Also, the projectiles are shaped like flechettes without the little fin the back.

Actually, I remember that Mickilla had specs for a similar weapon on DA. I pointed out that a needle wouldn't cause much hydrostatic shock and thus wouldn't be very effective, as it'd probably just sail right through. We pretty much agreed that the tip would be made of a harder material than the body, so mere milliseconds after it penetrated, the shock would cause the body to fragment into sharp metal shards and cause damage similar to a hollow-point round.

http://mickilla.deviantart.com/#/d2z3kzt

There it is. Now look about halfway down the comments to the conversation he and I had, and that should help.

Just had an idea that I wanted to see your thoughts on. And it kinda ties into the discussion about using bullets on preds. I was thinking, rather than seeking to do physical damage, what if the bullets were just used as delivery mechanisms. Like, if they were hollowed out and filled with a paralyzing medicine or toxin. Is that feasible?

Tuc135 wrote:

Just had an idea that I wanted to see your thoughts on. And it kinda ties into the discussion about using bullets on preds. I was thinking, rather than seeking to do physical damage, what if the bullets were just used as delivery mechanisms. Like, if they were hollowed out and filled with a paralyzing medicine or toxin. Is that feasible?

Considering how much of a toxin it would take to affect a 150ft tall giant animal, I don't see how it could be practical. Bullets wouldn't be able to hold much of it, and you'd still need to be able to deliver it to the pred's bloodstream, which would require a decent amount of penetration.

There's also the logistics of it to consider to. How would you synthesize such large amounts of a chemical?

I already have an idea that is superior to the use of bullets, I just ahve to type it up.

Let's go back to questions, shall we?

I was wondering if Nekos would have the habit of walking barefoot more often than humans. I personally think that wild tribes, or wilder nekos, would often be shoeless.

i think it depends on where they are living and what they do in life. i do not really see barefoot nekos in negav...i do see barefoot nekos in nekomura and other tribres.

I'd think footwear would depend on how wealthy and/or civilized the neko is. A poor or relatively tribal neko would probably go barefoot, but a wealthier or more modern-acting neko would have something on its feet. In Negav, yeah in the poorer parts I see lots of bare feet due to the lack of funds to purchase shoes.

I'd agree with those two on shoes.



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What separates Umbras from Darkness Elementals, and how come they are not found in the Evernight Forest?

AisuKaiko wrote:

I'd think footwear would depend on how wealthy and/or civilized the neko is. A poor or relatively tribal neko would probably go barefoot, but a wealthier or more modern-acting neko would have something on its feet. In Negav, yeah in the poorer parts I see lots of bare feet due to the lack of funds to purchase shoes.

There's also the possibility of animal-hide moccassin-like footwear. I mean, a Druiker is basically the same as a deer. I could see wild Neko tribes, or even Nekomurans using Druiker (or other animal hides) for clothing and footwear.

rcs619 wrote:

AisuKaiko wrote:

I'd think footwear would depend on how wealthy and/or civilized the neko is. A poor or relatively tribal neko would probably go barefoot, but a wealthier or more modern-acting neko would have something on its feet. In Negav, yeah in the poorer parts I see lots of bare feet due to the lack of funds to purchase shoes.

There's also the possibility of animal-hide moccassin-like footwear. I mean, a Druiker is basically the same as a deer. I could see wild Neko tribes, or even Nekomurans using Druiker (or other animal hides) for clothing and footwear.

Caroline wears a relatively mundane orange crop top with jean shorts and is a Nekomuran. But then again, she goes to Negav quite often, and her tutor is a fairly strong mage. I guess I better say this right now: any error of my own planning is probably because of things that has never been brought up before, hasn't been updated, and/or wasn't all that specific. Given that Nekomura has some relations with Negav, I think it's a fairly safe bet that they blur the line between wild and civilized Nekos.

I hope this is where I can ask this question.

I'm trying to draw an Ice Wyrm for the contest on dA and I'm reading over the file on the wiki and I'm a bit confused when it refers to "beaks."

Wiki entry:
" It resembles a gigantic worm, with a serpentine body and four massive armored beaks on its head, around its mouth"

Now I've never really drawn such a fantastical creature before so when I hear "beak," I think of birds. Is this referring more to horns or something? Or are they actually beaks? Any examples?

M19Kamikaze wrote:

I hope this is where I can ask this question.

I'm trying to draw an Ice Wyrm for the contest on dA and I'm reading over the file on the wiki and I'm a bit confused when it refers to "beaks."

Wiki entry:
" It resembles a gigantic worm, with a serpentine body and four massive armored beaks on its head, around its mouth"

Now I've never really drawn such a fantastical creature before so when I hear "beak," I think of birds. Is this referring more to horns or something? Or are they actually beaks? Any examples?

I think its trying to say that their mouth is made up of 4 armored plates that open and close.

http://nwn.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/10/14/rezzing_a_sandworm.jpg

Kind of like this. At least, that's what I got out of it. Karbo, or whoever made them may have to give a final confirmation.

rcs619 wrote:

I think its trying to say that their mouth is made up of 4 armored plates that open and close.

http://nwn.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/10/14/rezzing_a_sandworm.jpg

Kind of like this. At least, that's what I got out of it. Karbo, or whoever made them may have to give a final confirmation.

That's what I was guessing a first until it said, "around its mouth." Thank you. I'll be sure to ask Karbo about it for confirmation

hello if anyone would like to tell me how I can get an Avatar please let me know

Click on 'Profile' up at the top, then go to 'Avatar' and you can pick an image from your computer or an off-site image from a url or wherever.

thank you for telling me that:)

just who are the correcters? what did they look like?
why did they wage war with Felarya?
How long did that war last?
The Titians aside did anyone else fight alongside with the Gaurdians I.E. humans, nekos, nagas, or outside source.
just how did they manage to kill not 1 but 3 Guardians?
Just what did the wiki ment by they left perament scars where ever they clashed?
DO NOT QUOTE THE WIKI! to me this makes me think that you cant offer a personal input and makes you seem lazy.

Uhh, what's in the wiki is what's in the wiki. It's written fact, there really isn't any room for major interpretation.

That said, this has all of the known info in the Correctors.