Negav everyday life

Shady Knight wrote:

I love how every soldiers except the elf, who I still wouldn't let pass inspection if it were me, have the same face.

Of course they will have the same face to an extent, all soilders in fantasy fiction are just mooks who are there to die in large numbers for our own guitless entertainment, woulden't want to feel too much for them now would we?

The correct term is Red Shirts. Mooks are the enemy soldiers who get horribly butchered and mutilated by the hero to show how badass he is.

Well that depends on the perspective doesn't it? If the story is one that stars predators, then soilders will be mooks.

But what if someone, i.e. me, wrote a story where the protagonists are from Negav, wouldn't they then be Red Shirts?  Actually, since they're highly trained, have access to high-tech gear, sometimes enchanted, and are always accompanied by two battlemages, elite soldiers, would they qualify as Mook or Red Shirts?  They seem too competent and too well-equipped to be the kind of military who gets easily mowed down for fake drama.

Shady Knight wrote:

But what if someone, i.e. me, wrote a story where the protagonists are from Negav, wouldn't they then be Red Shirts?  Actually, since they're highly trained, have access to high-tech gear, sometimes enchanted, and are always accompanied by two battlemages, elite soldiers, would they qualify as Mook or Red Shirts?  They seem too competent and too well-equipped to be the kind of military who gets easily mowed down for fake drama.

Yes they would, but most authors don't write from the Negav armie's perspective. Some do, but it's very rare. When I said they were mooks, I meant in a general sense as that's the charactersation most authors portray them as.

Besides, it doesn't matter what they are called, Redshirts, Mooks, really the point is that armies are not generally seen as individuals in most fiction (unless it's a drama about the horror of war) and I suspect that's the idea Karbo is envoking in this picture.

Darkone wrote:

Yes they would, but most authors don't write from the Negav armie's perspective. Some do, but it's very rare. When I said they were mooks, I meant in a general sense as that's the characterization most authors portray them as.

*LAUGHS MANIACALLY*

As far as you know, but more in due time my friend.

Dark One wrote:

I would have thought most people would join the Isolon Fist for things like protecting the towns people, the glory, the honor, the respect, and their patriotism and loyalty to the Magiocrats.

The sort of things that a genuine pyscopath would have little care for. Sure, some of them might join just for the joy of battle, but that kind of bloodthirsty behavior could make them unreliable...

"Captain, I told you to just scare off the Naga...Your wreckless behavior have cost us twelve men and now we have a hundred foot Naga corpse in the middle of the road that we will have to move."

"But scaring it off wouldn't have been as fun."

XD Now I must make this OC cause that made me laugh hard and picture a Kenpachi Zaraki figure in Negav Battle Armor. X3 So cool!

Dark One wrote:

Yes they would, but most authors don't write from the Negav armie's perspective. Some do, but it's very rare.

Where?? I've looked for them! I've never found even one. =/ Would love to though. I plan to write some stuff about my Isolon Fist OCs. Heck the Isolon Fist is a key element in Clare's Quest.

Shady Knight wrote:

I love how every soldiers except the elf, who I still wouldn't let pass inspection if it were me, have the same face.

Well she's a White Cloak, a high battle mage, so likely she is taking advantage of the bit in the wiki that states they are allowed some personal changes to their attire. We all know most mages are vain people or sometimes that magic can take a toll on your stamina so wearing heavy armor isn't always a good idea.

Oh and on the picture I think it's pretty good, but you could vary she skin tones more. They look too similar to me. Other than that? I love that background! There needs to be more shots of ground level Negav. Too many people think of towers and bridges in the sky when they see it. I want to see it from the common man's perspective!

Actually most of them have different faces from one another.

A new picture in progress showing a tavern scene ^^  The big guy is probably bragging about how he took on 3 giant nagas or something XP
If you have any remark or suggestion, please don't hesitate !

Awww, this would have been the perfect drawing for Caldswell or Taihaku to be in! XD Anyway, I like the overall look and feel of it. A candle chandelier indicates this building doesn't get electricity, that's interesting to note. If you want to show that some buildings do get electricity, you should show bulb lighting or something like that in your next drawing of Negav life.

Personally, I think this drawing could use more diversity - All the people here appear to be humans. When you colour it, I think the guy in the beret to the left of the guy holding up three fingers should be a blonde, I think it'd suit him, since the rest of them look like they'd have dark or grey hair. Another idea - make that same guy's hair, eye, and skin colours the same as the waitress', I think it'd be cool to imply that they're related.

On the part of criticism, the man with the scar's index and ring fingers should be about the same length, I think, so you need to either make his 'ring' finger a little longer or you need to make his index finger shorter. Also what's up with the cup behind his wrist, is the man with the beret holding it? Those don't look like fingers on it at all. Also, the glass that the man with the scar is holding is tilted, so the surface of the liquid inside should be on an angle to the rim of the glass, not parallel to it like it is in this drawing. Also, there's a man with his arm raised in the background, but he appears to have something else behind him. Is it some kind of backpack, and if so, how is it being held up? Also, on an in-universe note, I think the candles on the chandelier should probably have something covering them, so that they don't catch the wood ceiling on fire and bring the whole place down.

That's all I can think of for now. :DI hope it helps!

I have to agree with Nyaha, there isn't much diversity among the adventuring parties you draw I noticed, even though this one isn't really an adventuring party. I won't split hair over skin color or ethnic diversities, if that applies in Negav, cause I will admit I am guilty of the same thing, however, the only picture I remember seeing both nekos, elves and humans together in it was the one with Commander Hartman training his yelling voice against Isolon Fist soldiers, and even then, it was only one neko and only one elf. I understand that humans are more common than nekos and elves, and the latter usually tend to keep to themselves, but seeing a little more nekos and elves working with humans would add some nice diversity, especially if the picture takes place in Negav, where it's essentially a melting pot of races and humanoid species, and you would expect to see demi humans more often.

Nyaha made some pretty good points.

I'd say this looks no different from your average Tavern.
-What makes it unique to Negav?
-Should you maybe draw the inn bigger, with the table shown at the front the main focus
-You could also include some magi tech in it as well, like the light-batteries powered by those mazhir crystals
-Heat runes as well if you manage to include part of a kitchen, or what the bar counter they get their ale looks like.
-Is it a specific inn? There could be a wooden plaque somewhere displaying the Inn's name and a custom design/symbol.
-Maybe you could angle it so there's a window showing part of the street outside with passers-by.

Shady is right, maybe include some more races. Smaller nagas are rarely seen in Negav, but they do exist. A naga barmaid might be very cute. A neko or inu, maybe hide some tinies up in a corner somewhere, an elf might be nice, but they're rare, and I doubt we'd see a Nemesis, but it could be fascinating though, as they've yet to be drawn at all. All in all though, I would like to see a wider perspective shown, because the way it is now looks like some alleyway with a roof over it. And beer. And adventurers. And, well, you get the idea XD

Great potential here though, and I cant wait to see how it turns out!

Archmage_Bael wrote:

Nyaha made some pretty good points.

I'd say this looks no different from your average Tavern.
-What makes it unique to Negav?
-Should you maybe draw the inn bigger, with the table shown at the front the main focus
-You could also include some magi tech in it as well, like the light-batteries powered by those mazhir crystals
-Heat runes as well if you manage to include part of a kitchen, or what the bar counter they get their ale looks like.
-Is it a specific inn? There could be a wooden plaque somewhere displaying the Inn's name and a custom design/symbol.
-Maybe you could angle it so there's a window showing part of the street outside with passers-by.

Shady is right, maybe include some more races. Smaller nagas are rarely seen in Negav, but they do exist. A naga barmaid might be very cute. A neko or inu, maybe hide some tinies up in a corner somewhere, an elf might be nice, but they're rare, and I doubt we'd see a Nemesis, but it could be fascinating though, as they've yet to be drawn at all. All in all though, I would like to see a wider perspective shown, because the way it is now looks like some alleyway with a roof over it. And beer. And adventurers. And, well, you get the idea XD

Great potential here though, and I cant wait to see how it turns out!

First, I think the point is for it to be an average tavern, that's what Karbo was going for. And second, since when can small nagas enter Negav? O.o

I was just about to say, a smaller naga and the like would get kicked out. Negav isn't the most welcoming place for anything that resemble a giant predator. That's pretty much the whole point behind the Motamo Docks, that's as close as the top brass will allow them to stay.

Actually no, smaller nagas can go into Negav. Last time I checked the wiki, they can enter the city. Motamo docks isn't the only place they'd go, I don't even see where it says they stay there exclusively.

Can you show us where exactly it says that?

I can show you where it doesn't, haha. "Small Nagas" under "Nagas" and "Races":

A much more common variant than their giant cousins but encountered less, "small nagas", who are approximately human-sized, are very elusive. As the majority of them are loners, similar to their giant cousins, they prefer to avoid confrontations with groups, especially those consisting of humans. Their skins sell well in certain markets, and there are plenty of people harboring a grudge against their larger cousins to justify hunting them for such reasons. Most smaller nagas tend to give Negav a wide berth as a result of these bad relations, and so the humans living there are widely unfamiliar with them. Like their giant counterparts, small nagas are able to swallow creatures their size and so are dangerous to humans. However they will only attack human-sized prey when they are sure they have a place to safely digest without their movement being handicapped by a bloated tail. To a giant predator, a small naga that's just eaten a big meal is a very easy and filling catch. Therefore they are rather careful about attempting to eat such comparably large prey, and may consider for some time the circumstances before deciding to eat you or not, conversing all the while. Some clever small nagas are able to get away with eating humans often as long as larger suspects are blamed, but many more would rather keep away. Like nekos, they often prey on tinies. Small nagas sometimes form far-between villages, which are rather rare. wrote:

It doesn't say they cant enter, which means of course that its possible if one or two decided they wanted to try. I imagine an adventurer who brings a naga egg back, and it hatches before he can sell it or something, then got teh feelz, and raised her, would live a pretty different life behind those walls, especially in the community.

I'd be willing to assume a case like that would be rare, but as its *smaller* naga eggs, far far more likely. Given the way the Isolon Eye affects races and mentalities and habits, and the community knowing about this naga would likely have no real reason to hate him/her other than the fact they're a naga-which is racism on a base level equal to that of Nekos, since everyone knows that Nekos are very predator toward tinies.

Gray area much? Definitely, and possible, that's the point.

My rebuttal:

The Motamo Docks Entry wrote:

The Motamo Docks exist outside of Negav, to the Northeast of the city. It is essentially a smaller community, existing on the shores of the Motamo river. There is not much trade or travel on the river, but what little exists is handled here. This small village is also known as something of a satellite community, like Nekomura. Smaller hybrid species, such as small dridders or nagas, occasionally attempt to move towards civilization, or to seek protection from the big predators that prey on them. However, there are laws in place barring these races from entering Negav, as Negavians mostly doesn't trust them - smaller nagas and dridders can still be dangerous, even if they appear to be able to pass through the anti-predatory field of the Isolon Eye. Thus, these races started to congregate beside the Motamo River, close enough to Negav to benefit from the Isolon Eye, but not within the walls where they could perturb the rest of the populace. Some resent this rejection, others are happy to be able to live with protection while still retaining some of their traditions.

And yet...

The Fringelis Star is the biggest bar where non-humans gather in Negav, many of them being frown upon in other drinking establishments. It's a strange, exotic, and rather shady place, where you could find the very rare hybrids such as nagas inhabiting Negav wrote: wrote:

Not that I agree with it's inclusion, but it is indeed there.

Doesn't make alot of sense to me, you'd think Negav's information on predators would be pretty well documented and incredably detailed if they had hybrids living there who could shed alot of information about their biology and psychology.

Karbo wrote:

IMAGE

A new picture in progress showing a tavern scene ^^  The big guy is probably bragging about how he took on 3 giant nagas or something XP
If you have any remark or suggestion, please don't hesitate !

#1 I think it needs to show that this place is made of "negavian building material". Until now, this could be any tavern, whether it be a fantasy style one or even a modern tavern in our real world. Aside from the trophies on the walls, there is no visible difference so far that could show different styles of culture.

#2 We only see humans, however, I think while its okay to show a purely human group in the front, (humans might prefer to stick together) there definately need to be more abstract creatures in there, and I#m not talking just about Inus and Nekos, but about Dridders, Centaurs, maybe something completely alien-like with no human upper body as well, all talking together happily or maybe beating up each other. Maybe the bartender serving the drinks could be a cute Inu or Neko as well (i know of at least one Negavian tavern owner that is an Inu ) since they might be widely seen as cute, that might actually make sense. You could also put a neera or two on the table in the front, listening to the guy as well and applauding him or something, just to show some tinies that are neglected so often. ^^

#3 You included many traditional items, such as pipes and the beercan. I think they need Negavian decoration, some strange insignias or something, just to make them different from earthern ones. The candles in the tavern could be magical as well, giving it another mood or touch. Maybe a deep orange that fits the warm and safe atmosphere, or something in mystical bright blue, depending on what mood you want to create. After all, Mood largely depends on the choice of colours.

#4 There is an object blocking the view on the upper left corner, right next to the head of the guy smoking the pipe. I cannot see WHAT that is, but it looks like a wall and it makes the room look REALLY small since it gives the viewer some kind of tunnel-view. Im not sure if you wanted to achieve that, but if you didn't, let me make clear that you might want to think about removing said object in order to make the room look bigger.

#5 The bragging man's arm should be rotated counterclockwise. The arm beneath the hand doesn't lead straight down, it actually leads to the lower left, however, anatomy-wise it should lead to the lower right or at least straight down to the ground. The hand itself is in proper position though, I think you just need to rotate the arm beneath it.


Uhm, I guess that's pretty much about it. Hope it helps! :3

Yeah good call with the hand there. When I held up my own hand I was like "wait, is that his left or right?" If it's his right hand then its fine, but in that case, is the beer mug his? Or the guy on his right's? I'm pretty sure its supposed to be his left, because it looks like the mug is turned handle-toward him, otherwise the handle would be visible with the other guy's hand around it.

Even with that object on the side...which I BELIEVE is a drape on a window just like on the other side, makes that room *really* small to begin with. So good call on that Amaroq...now of course we cant tell you what to draw, but I don't think a small enclosed space is ideal for what should be a big-inclusive atmosphere, y'know?

Still. Cant wait to see the update Always wanted a pub scene.

Amaroq wrote:

#4 There is an object blocking the view on the upper left corner, right next to the head of the guy smoking the pipe. I cannot see WHAT that is, but it looks like a wall and it makes the room look REALLY small since it gives the viewer some kind of tunnel-view. Im not sure if you wanted to achieve that, but if you didn't, let me make clear that you might want to think about removing said object in order to make the room look bigger.

Wait....maybe we're getting perspective of the "Tinies" section of the tavern! When you think about it like that, and look at the thickness of the lines comprising the four people in the foreground, and then compare their proportions to those of people clearly behind them, it makes it look like there's a fair distance between the foreground people and the waitress and smoking man behind them!! O.o It'd explain the wall right there, as well as the strange separation between the group of four and the rest of the tavern behind them.

I think they are just sitting a corner of the bar and we are looking out.

Thank you all for your feedbacks   
It's going to be very helpful ^^ and yeah I'm going to put in more details there on the walls and on the characters to give it a bit more of an unique feel. As for the object on the left, well it's a curtain but now that I look at it , indeed it might "cramp" the scene more than needed ^^;

Well I'm anxious to see the update then