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Ilceren
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Tue Sep 29, 2015 9:57 am

That is a simple case of personal preference. If you want to create a serious story within Felarya, one that, according to you, has nothing of fetish, then go ahead and do so, no one is holding you back. What you can't ask is for other people to write them for you, you can't force them to agree to your view of the world. I think pretty much everyone has his or her own unique view of Felarya.

Case example, I, personally, don't like vore that much, so my stories will never focus solely on it. It will, however, appear regularly as topics of conversation, side references, little tidbits here and there. Why? Well, because in my vision, vore is an integral part of Felarya that can't simply be denied. It will be present in any everyday life, even in the safe haven that is Negav. It is merely my personal choice not to focus on it.

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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Tue Sep 29, 2015 12:46 pm

Karbo wrote:

Well kindly refrain from that please. That kind of mission " I'm going to change Felarya" doesn't usually ends very well for anyone.  Felarya has been built from a fetish standpoint and it's always going to keep at least some aspects of it. And if you want to build stuff for Felarya you are going to have to work with it rather than trying to remove it. It's honestly not going to happens.

Aye. If you don't like the direction Felarya goes then you can write your own cannon as I do. Or better yet! Make your own Felarya like universe to amplify the aspects you wish to see more and cut away the ones you wish not to see so much. ^_^
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Tue Sep 29, 2015 2:23 pm

Chihiro Fujisaki wrote:
90% of Felaryan writers on DA focus on writing fetish stories as opposed to grand adventures.

90%? Where are you getting that number from? in my personal experaince there's a surprising lack of fetish material ouside Karbo and about a dozen or so other artists. If you only check that handful out, then sure, you'll get vore galore. But go beyound that number you'll find pleanty of adventure stuff......admittedly alot of it is bog standard fanfiction fare, amauter drawings and lots and lots of uninteresting human ocs, but still it's an exaggeration to say it's 90% fetish.

Though Stabs has read more felarya stories than anyone else here, mabye he can confirm my claim? (Or set me straight?)


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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Tue Sep 29, 2015 2:44 pm

Chihiro Fujisaki wrote:
90% of Felaryan writers on DA focus on writing fetish stories as opposed to grand adventures.

See there's your problem. Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is garbage, especially when talking about something as chaotic an unregulated as fanfiction.

I've actually been talking about Felarya to friends and co-workers and getting fairly positive reception. I mention that it stars man-eating monsters who actually aren't that bad when you get to know them; I think it's that defiance of expectation, the subversion of the "things that eat people are heinous monsters" trope that most of us never bothered to question that makes Felarya compelling to non-voraphiles, and that's the angle I focus on when I want to pitch Felarya to the passing layman. The thing is if you want to introduce Felarya to outsiders, you don't have to shove the entire body of work made in it on them. Show them the "main comics" (the ones that have "Tome X" written on them) and the wiki, then cherry pick the best fanfiction to present.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Tue Sep 29, 2015 8:19 pm

Chihiro Fujisaki wrote:
Of course a cannibal would not see eating people as wrong, however, we would not condone their actions and try to justify them. We would condemn them and demand they be rounded up and thrown in prison, because they are cannibals and are doing something very immoral and sick. Felarya is a very different context as well, which I have said and admitted to.

But try to picture them in a primitive, paleolithic world, where there is only your group's rule and their's. The cannibals tend to think that their actions are good, because that will be the model of their philosophy. You can't just imprison cannibals in that time period, considering that you can't even go near them in the first place. They would simply consider you as enemies to be destroyed, to be feasted upon and not even think of you as human. That is mostly the problem of psychology. People tend to think differently from other, and their environment molds them. But if you try to change them without understanding their way of thinking, then you will have a hard time.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Wed Sep 30, 2015 4:41 am



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seriousness#Philosophical_attitudes_toward_seriousness

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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Mon Oct 05, 2015 9:38 pm

XionGaTaosenai wrote:
Chihiro Fujisaki wrote:
90% of Felaryan writers on DA focus on writing fetish stories as opposed to grand adventures.

See there's your problem. Sturgeon's Law: 90% of everything is garbage, especially when talking about something as chaotic an unregulated as fanfiction.

I've actually been talking about Felarya to friends and co-workers and getting fairly positive reception. I mention that it stars man-eating monsters who actually aren't that bad when you get to know them; I think it's that defiance of expectation, the subversion of the "things that eat people are heinous monsters" trope that most of us never bothered to question that makes Felarya compelling to non-voraphiles, and that's the angle I focus on when I want to pitch Felarya to the passing layman. The thing is if you want to introduce Felarya to outsiders, you don't have to shove the entire body of work made in it on them. Show them the "main comics" (the ones that have "Tome X" written on them) and the wiki, then cherry pick the best fanfiction to present.

I'm impressed that you pitch Felarya to strangers. I'd be really interested in more details of how that went down, i.e. best responses, worst responses, % of people with strong positive reactions, % of people with strong negative reactions. How many people total?
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Mon Oct 05, 2015 10:22 pm

"Pitch Felarya to strangers" is maybe over-selling it. I've talked about it with 2 people, both close friends. I've yet to actually show either of them anything, but we talk about it semi-frequently. Neither of them are into vore, but both were interested in the setting despite it. I told them to expect a lot of vore, as the creator is actually into that kind of thing, and they both were okay with that in a "to each their own" kind of way.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Tue Oct 06, 2015 10:03 am

I've spoken about Felarya to other people before, talking about the setting itself and less of the sexualized content in it. The setting is somewhat unique anyway, despite AoT - as that came after this forum was already set up, haha.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Tue Oct 06, 2015 9:46 pm

Very interesting, and kudos to you guys for being open to spread the word about it.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:25 am

Interesting take on humanity

I was like most of you until literally five minutes ago. The humans of Felarya have their own unique lifestyle and treat others how we would other people. But, that is not so, it is a false comparison. The humans are still, quite literally, budding serial killers. Because while yes, trying to live in a dangerous world is a understandable cause we all can sympathize with, they seem to take more than just the normal amount of pleasure in lying, tricking and killing. It is not something they passively so, they deceive, play, and toy with their prey.

Negav for some unexplained reason, has a culculating physcopath in charge of the tourism guild, whom deliberately draws innocent people into the world of felarya through misinformation and misdirection simply in order to boost tourism in Negav, purposely failing to warn them of the dangers of leaving the city. One would have thought that that outside worlds would put pressure on Negav to cut out this false advertising and man slaughter, and yet nothing has been done by the authorities to do such a thing, surposingly Malki Greenbeard's excuses for these crimes are enougth to persaude everyone to let him off. in other words the Negavian government is easily manlipuated by a physcopath, or they just don't care.

Negav also has a gladiator arena where veiwers enjoy seeing combatents fight death matches that sometimes conclude with the beast of the day swallowing the losers, the fighters are only rescued if the crowd thinks they "deserved it."
This is no mere underground fight club, this arena is legally recognized, the authorities seem to have decided that the risk of backlash in illegalizing such brutality was too much of a risk and opted out from doing the right thing....even though they are powerful mages and have access to a military than can surposeingly fight gaints that they could easily have called upon to instill order if they simply had choose to....but hey, whatever works as an excuse I guess.

Negav's lower tier ecomony seems to entirely exist on the need of adventurers, in other words they make their living on selling products to people who leave the city...knowing full well what will happen to them. Instead of humanliy trying to discourage adventurers from throwing their lives away, the Negavian shop keepers instead take advantage of them, milk as much money as they can get from them and then let them be on their way....sometimes with subpar and flawed gear

The law enforcement of Negav is said to be "slow to react and currupted."

The government are authoritarian which means they are only interested in benifiting the few, and not the many.

Felaryan humans, at least how they are currently portrayed, are unlikable for the reasons that they take pride in the manipulation and utter apathy towards their own fellow man, they do not show their own kind respect, they do not value their lives like normal humans value the lives of others. *drops mic*
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Wed Oct 07, 2015 9:26 am

See, this is part of the reason why I'm rewriting Negav's main page, which you can view on the Fleshing Out thread. It received rave reviews and has proven immensely popular, at the risk of sounding self-indulgent. The Tourism Guild, like the Felarya Express, don't make a lick of sense and the only reason they're still around is by the will of the author. I am reforming the former because, when you think about it, there are plenty of sights just within Negav to entice a few tourists, one of which is the Arena for the sake of a convenient segue. The article for the arena does mention that fights are a lot less bloody than they used to be, though still brutal, and that there are "characters" involved. So it seems to me that the Arena is trying to be akin to pro-wrestling. That said, the idea of fighters only being let out of beasts that have eaten them only if deemed worthy also doesn't make sense and is yet another instance of enforcing vore where it does not belong for the sake of having for. Also, the bit of selling gears to adventurer doesn't necessarily mean they have to go out in Felarya. They can very well be buying stuff in Negav and then leave to another world with it. Still, the implication that they're sticking to Felarya is there. And the less said about the current police force, the better.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Wed Oct 07, 2015 5:23 pm

DarkOne wrote:
Interesting take on humanity
Felaryan humans, at least how they are currently portrayed, are unlikable for the reasons that they take pride in the manipulation and utter apathy towards their own fellow man, they do not show their own kind respect, they do not value their lives like normal humans value the lives of others. *drops mic*

Valid points I really hadn't thought about before, but honestly? I don't think we should shy away from this. Look most humans preds eat? Are either evil, greedy or otherwise deserve it to most viewers eyes anyway and this description supports it. Actually it makes me wish to re-examine my own "heroes" and see how moral they really are. I'd like to see soembody give an example of a 'heroic' Negavian actually. Heck Lea is an offworlder and she has shown a practical adaptation typical of humans bonded to preds, in that example of the second Tome I think it was, she ignored people's pleas for help as Crisis eats them. Gunther? Manipulative bastard thief. Pal Sebrit? Practical mercenary. Ramtov Telekine: Pervert~ Wha ha ha ha! Seliky.......<.< Well okay maybe there's one pure of heart humanoid OC. XP
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Thu Oct 08, 2015 6:28 pm

Yeah Jedi, this is why I like to dabble in characters that don't have any onset morality, and are more robotic. They don't feel like martyrs who have to die for everyone, but on the other hand they don't feel the need to be edgy Mcbadguy on a whim. Truth be told, I feel like this might be a weakness, but I'd rather play it safe than risk making a bad character who has no real place in Felarya except for a shallow one-off note. You know what I mean?

With more organic predator characters, I've always had problems writing them. I didn't know whether to make them assholes or saints, or try mixing them up. If you've ever read the fiction I wrote on this site, you could tell that I didn't know how to write them too well, and I've always pondered on the idea of going back and completely fixing them, if it weren't for me being a little on the lazy side.

But I don't wanna get too far off topic.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Thu Oct 08, 2015 9:13 pm

Pendragon wrote:
Yeah Jedi, this is why I like to dabble in characters that don't have any onset morality, and are more robotic. They don't feel like martyrs who have to die for everyone, but on the other hand they don't feel the need to be edgy Mcbadguy on a whim. Truth be told, I feel like this might be a weakness, but I'd rather play it safe than risk making a bad character who has no real place in Felarya except for a shallow one-off note. You know what I mean?

With more organic predator characters, I've always had problems writing them. I didn't know whether to make them assholes or saints, or try mixing them up. If you've ever read the fiction I wrote on this site, you could tell that I didn't know how to write them too well, and I've always pondered on the idea of going back and completely fixing them, if it weren't for me being a little on the lazy side.

But I don't wanna get too far off topic.

HmmI usually am the opposite. I like making well defined organic OCs but then again I usually write humor. Only in Felarya have I found myself writing dramedy more and more in my fics, particully even Karbo noted I finally got soem suspense writing in with Silent Protagonist where i wrote some humor but also allot more dramtic bits and used characters who weren't all completely pure of heart, just not evil just cowardly or greedy but not in a over flashy way.

Never a bad idea to go back and edit one's stories if one can pick them out. I recently realized I only parttialy wrote a character appearing in a scene and nobody had told me. - -; Her literally just appeared out of thin air and the characters acted like it was planned out and well explained at least. Ugh. Not to mention the messed up origins of Shadowblade. *Facepalm* I mean I know you're allowed a few mistakes your first time out of the gate but that was just a dumb open-ended plot thread that'll come to nothing in the end.

Annnd just so I don't get bashed with the "Off Topic Hammer of Bashing Off Topicers" let me say morals are fine and good to have in a character but honestly Felarya posits unique morals to each race. For example to Harpies cursing is normal speak. Demons? Trickery is common place and it'd be rude to be honest to somebody face as well the ever lovable fairies with their Wonderland-like sense of childish logic. So really evil and good may not have a clear a line in Felarya and at the end of the day don't even really serve the protagonist in helping them to survive. It's better to go the "Grey Jedi" route that Qui Gon Jin did. Do some 'dark' things that bend the rules but don't go about trying to gather power and take over everything. Just keep yourself and the one's you care for/need alive by whatever is necessary.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Fri Oct 09, 2015 4:02 pm

You make several good points, especially regarding morality. Someday I'll have to return to some of my fics and fix them up, with this new view on the system. Thanks!
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Sun Oct 11, 2015 2:27 am

DarkOne: I should point out that not all Felaryan humans are Negavians. There are a few other canon safe settlements which seem like much more pleasant places to live. And then there are the "wild" indigenous humans of the forest, who live in small groups, dodging predators. These different categories have very different lives, and rules.

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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:51 am

French snack wrote:
DarkOne: I should point out that not all Felaryan humans are Negavians. There are a few other canon safe settlements which seem like much more pleasant places to live. And then there are the "wild" indigenous humans of the forest, who live in small groups, dodging predators. These different categories have very different lives, and rules.

And not all predators are a hundred foot tall man eating creatres living isolated in the wild...in fact in some cases the word 'predator' becomes an incredibly redundant term given that it seems to describe a unsocailised lifestyle, not a ethnic demographic.

I know not all humans are assholes, I was simply venting frustration at the tendancy seem people in the community seem to have when they get all wound up over the predators behavior on one hand while turning a complete blind eye to the behavior of significant human populations, Negav might not be the only human settlement, but it's one of the largest if not the largest, and therefore makes up a good percentage of the human repersentation on Felarya.

It just feels very dishonest to me, it annoys me when some people seem to have the general attitude that "The acts of the Felaryan predators must be treated very seriously and become the target of never ending moral conversations,....but human's are allowed to act in comical immoral anti-hero shenanigans and will never be called out for it."

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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Mon Oct 12, 2015 4:57 pm

Humans are doing it to each other. Here is a good example. No one gives a flying crap what Stalin did to his own people. They say it was bad, but shrug it off. But everyone cares about what Hitler did to minority populations in German occupied nations. What you do to someone else is always worse than what you do to yourself.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Mon Oct 12, 2015 5:12 pm

Just because people don't give Stalin's atrocities as much publicity as Hitler doesn't means that what Stalin did wasn't heinous. And using this line of reasoning to justify demonizing predators while turning a blind eye to what the humans do reeks of hypocrisy.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Mon Oct 12, 2015 5:36 pm

Chihiro Fujisaki wrote:
Humans are doing it to each other. Here is a good example. No one gives a flying crap what Stalin did to his own people. They say it was bad, but shrug it off. But everyone cares about what Hitler did to minority populations in German occupied nations. What you do to someone else is always worse than what you do to yourself.

I am not talking about the relative opinons of fictional characters, that can be a great thing in morally ambiguous narratives.

I am talking about contributors that claim to want moral absolution in Felarya (as in the predators have no excuse to eat people and are evil, regardless of their upbringing, no matter how hungry they are, regardless of the fact they are not truely socialised, evil is evil. There's no such thing as opinons on such matters, there's no such thing as being misguided, evil is just evil.)
And yet these contributors ignore human immorally if not outright glorify it.
So in other words these people want to play it 'morally absolute' with the predators, but 'morally ambiguous' with the humans.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Mon Oct 12, 2015 5:58 pm

If you look back at my posts on this, I don't believe I ever spoke out against predators eating smaller sapient beings. If you are speaking about me in that regard than you are putting words in my mouth, because that is not the case. I was speaking on how predators treated their prey. It would be akin to me capturing a poor rabbit and teasing it, torturing it psychologically. In this case of course imagine the rabbit has sapient intelligence. You know who plays around with their prey? Cats, and other animals that are not up to the intelligence of human beings. We cannot compare predators to us, we can only compare them to ancient hunter-gatherers, which I repeat, DID NOT torture their prey physically or emotionally.

Instead of the Stalin and Hitler comparison, think of it this way. Imagine me bullying another adult man because I hold a higher station than him. Wrong? Yes. Immoral? Yes. Now, imagine me bullying an infant, or a child, because I can. That is far worse than what I am doing to the person who holds equal standing to me in the physical sense. But, you did also assume I am okay with what humans do to each other. I am not. But at least they are the same size and can combat each other on equal grounds if it comes down to it. Something they cannot to with predators.

Just remember the topic. How predators treat their sapient prey. Not predators eating sapient beings in general.
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Mon Oct 12, 2015 6:14 pm

You people are still falling for this thread? Seriously?
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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Tue Oct 13, 2015 2:27 am

Okay.

Calm down everyone. And please abstain from throwing Hitler and Stalin in the mix or this thread won't last long, thank you.

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PostSubject: Re: Interesting Take on Predation   Wed Oct 14, 2015 8:46 pm

As a historian, historic examples and metaphors are what I am best at. I apologize, I suppose.
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